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Whats signficant?

1 by WillLill
Hello all!

I'm new to this forum so I'll just jump straight in.

I've used horary on and off for a number of years usually in times of crisis to be honest. Having not employed horary for a while I felt compelled to after another maddening sleepless night over - you guessed it - a failed relationship.

My question wasn't wether there was still a chance or not, but rather "Should I contact her and tell her how I feel?". Not to go into too great detail the worse part for me was not just her absence but that (and I only have hearsay to support this) she seemed to have washed her hands of me completley. What I really wanted to ellicit was if she still held feelings for me, though the break-up was mutual.

Now in reading the chart signification became an issue. 5th house or 7th for the lover? (As the question was in regard to feeling I suspected the 5th house might be more appropriate). Also I became fixated on Venus applying conjunction to the Ascendent. For some reason (wishfull thinking?) I took this to mean that she might in fact get in contact with me?

If anyone has the time I would appreciate a second opinion. I certainly need to sharpen my technique!

I will try and post the image of the chart when I can work out how too![/img]

3 by WillLill
Yeah, I tried that and guess what - no positive aspects! In fact nothing at all. What I'm interested in is when a horary doesn't seem to show active symbolism when the rules are applied, but seems 'active' and 'radical' elsewhere. For instance in this case the fifth house is ruled by Venus and venus is apllying conjunction to the Ascendent. Also my significator the moon is in Virgo (I always take this to be a symbol of worry on the part of the querent), and in mutual reception to mercury in Cancer, which is the ruler of the third house (communication obviously).

How much do aspects to the ascendent figure in a horary? Do they just frame the nature of the question (Venus rising=a radical question about a relationship), or can the ascendent point be as relevant as the ruling planet?

4 by Taurus7
What I'm interested in is when a horary doesn't seem to show active symbolism when the rules are applied, but seems 'active' and 'radical' elsewhere.
If the chart seems radical and it doesn't show active connections between the primary significators, it implies that there is no connection between them. You have to see if the primary rulers are doing anything with each other. If they're not, then nothing's going on.
What I really wanted to ellicit was if she still held feelings for me, though the break-up was mutual
You can check for receptions between you and her to figure out if she still has feelings for you. But thinking through this logically, why would she wash her hands off you if she still had any feelings? Furthermore, lack of aspect indicates there will be no movement from either side towards the other. I doubt if the ruler of the 5th conjunct the ascendant has any signficance in this horary, even though Venus can be used to signify the woman. What's more important is the main rulers and the Moon.

5 by WillLill
Thats intersting. I suppose when casting horary's for ourselfs, especially ones of a personal nature, by only focusing on the chart within the framework of horary rules it limits our ability to start subjectivly seeking an answer we may want, but isn't clearly stated.

It's probably also why it's best sometimes to seek the objective opinion of another party. Much thanks for the replies!

6 by WillLill
Rather than start a new thread I was just wondering about another question that I asked in relation to the above matter. The question is rather emotivley, "Does she still love me?". The chart is radical. The ruler or the quesited is Mercury at 5 degrees Leo, and I'm at 11 degrees Scorpio, so obviously a nasty sqaure aspect. My second signifier the moon is at 3 degrees Taurus, obviously applying to another sqaure with her signifer Mercury.

I just wondered that in these situations does this spell hate for me? I could understand perhaps indifference as shown by no aspects, but this horoscope picture is something else!

Any ideas how to judge with-in this context.

Much thanks, Will

7 by yuzuru
I think you should apply care... horary in moments of suffering can become a tool to self undoing and nostalgia over decisions we took, or over futures we will never have.
If you already took the decision that the break up is mutual and non reversible, then there is no point in asking "does she still love me".
As the question was in regard to feeling I suspected the 5th house might be more appropriate
You see my point here ? You are not asking about some person, you are asking about the feelings of the person. This only make things very tricky. You will not even be able to know if this horary is true or not, because according to you, you?re not asking if you are going back together (true or not true) but about feelings which are by nature invisible and ambiguous. This only raises the chance of a mistake in judgement.

If I have misunderstand your new question, please forgive me. I just think that some wounds are better not to be picked if possible.

8 by WillLill
Whilst I do respect and appreciate the concerns you bring up I have tried to present the issues presented in both horarys as questions of technique. Of course horarys are never just technical excercises, and are brrought alive by the human, emotional context of the question.

What I am askin as an abstraction from my question is, beyound purely personal interest, in horarys of a romantic nature, what do the negative aspects between two signifactors, signify?

Surely it shows some level of contact, or interaction, either physically or emotionally. Or in thesimple yes/no approach, would eithe a sqaure or no aspects simply result in a no, in answer to the question.

It is surely only in the use and engagement with horarys, be they of a personal or proffesional nature, that questions of technique and interpretation arise.

I am touched by your concerns, genuinly, and in turn am sorry if perhaps my questions have been misconstrued on this forum as 'emotional neediness'. In future I will be more scant with information regarding the background to my queries.

Thanks,

Will

9 by Sue
Hi WillLill,

You seem to have used 1st/5th house for your last question 'does she still love me? This question may be about feelings but it is still feelings about another person. This is 7th house. Questions of this nature are always 1st/7th house. If there are no aspects then there is no contact between you. You cannot then decide to use the 5th house because there are aspects. Squares do not necessarily mean that she hates you. Aspects indicate the type of contact. So , if there was a trine, this would indicate that the contact is one of a positive nature. If it is a square it indicates that the contact will be one of tension. I would then look to reception to determine how the parties feel about each other. If there is mutual reception by rulership, exaltation, triplicity, or a combination of triplicity, terms and face, for example, it may indicate positive feelings for each other. Look to the condition of the planets for their ability or inability to act in any given situation. You can still have tense contact (e.g. square) between two people who love each other. It just might mean that this relationship will not work out or that you are unable to come to any resolution.

10 by Moondance7
Will, Sue's answer is a good one, I think. It helped me sort out some guidelines bcause I frequently do the same thing you are doing.

Don't feel you can't share background in future. Everyone who does an horary "needs" something, or they wouldn't be doing it! Right now your feelings are still understndably in turmoil and a cooler head helps you through it.

Thanks, Sue. I'm going to reread your reply. It resonates. :lol:

11 by carnna
I learned this and it still helps tremendously.

as the astrologer casting the horary AND the querent:
you must be "mind-full" of the question.
asking muddled questions give muddled answers.
"pre-meditation" of the question means knowing the question fully, AND especially what (house & natural rulers) rules that which is being asked.

we all know the rulers of the querent, it is in KNOWING prior to casting what rules that which is being asked about and how to derive the charts answer while not searching for that needle in the haystack.
this brings about the "maturity" of the question in fulfilling the "ripeness" i.e. "there is a time and a season for.....etc."

in emotionally charged questions sometimes it is best to have someone else read the chart so your not tempted to search for crumbs.....or keep the chart and re-read it in one moon's full cycle from the time it is cast. (distance helps.....~grin)
The hard part is in accepting the answer (a lot of the time).
I empathsize 'cause I learned this the hard way.
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