Natal chart of Nicola Sturgeon -- ex-First Minister of Scotland and Leader of the Scottish National Party from 2014 to 2023:
Sturgeon was arrested on 11 June and questioned for 7 hours by Scottish police as part of an investigation into the (mis)use of SNP finances, which also involves her husband. She has been having her feet held to the fire for a while with transiting Uranus on her natal Saturn, and transiting Pluto opposing her chart ruler, Mars.
Her solar return next month has Mars and Saturn in opposition (Mars: 5 Virgo, Saturn: 6 Pisces), so that shows more strain for the year ahead; yet it is buried in the cadent 12th and 6th houses and aligns with Sturgeon's natal Venus. That Venus is in debility, but still in good aspect to her ascendant, so I suspect she will personally escape the worst of her fears (though not without damage), by lying low, playing for time and being evasive. But Venus is her 7th ruler - hard to see how that is not showing real damage to her husband (then reflecting back to her as part of that). Still, the chart themes are all very cloudy - I would be surprised if the public feel they ever hear the truth of it.

i think she is a witch who served the wrong peoples interests for a long time and i have thought this for a long time too..

thanks for making the post deb.. i have some things i want to say about this chart and some questions too.. but i am sharing this in sidereal not tropical zodiac..

here's her chart in sidereal.




here are the transits for today which are on the outside wheel with the natal chart on the inside.. we see t uranus in the area of her natal saturn, t jupiter conjunct her descendant, the transiting nodal axis playing an important role here and having gone over her ascendant axis the past few months, and at present t mars doing a mars return and transiting the same sign at present - the planet that rules the 7th house in her chart.. below is the chart for consideration..



the emphasis on the 7th house in all of my above astro comments tells me her partnership, marriage or whatever the relationship is - is very much in focus at present.. so is she with the solar eclipse data based off where the transiting nodal axis is at present.. presently mercury, the ruler of the 12th is transiting the 8th bringing this issue of legal matters right out into the open.. i am using whole house system. her natal chart has a very close 45 aspect with mercury and pluto which to me reflects a person who keeps secrets and uses info in a manipulative way... that is the down side.. i am sure there is an upside too which others can ponder..

now, i want to ask the question.. what exactly are the primary directions that others think solicit her place here in 2023 and which is really a strong fall from grace and the place she held for a number of years?

here is what i get off my particular primary direction settings.. saturn-uranus square connection - saturn is in her 7th natal house and in fall in aries.. that is for april 4, 2024.. the other one is opposition of moon to pluto for april 14th 2024.. there is also the square of mars to venus april 21st 2024....

what do others see with regard to primary directions? please share your insights to help me better understand the relevancy of this tool that some here advocate for regularly, but generally never give examples on.. thanks..

James, please avoid comments like this:

"i think she is a witch who served the wrong peoples interests for a long time and i have thought this for a long time too.. "

We're looking for cool astrological analysis here - logic based on what we see astrologically in the chart; otherwise the astrology becomes soiled by prejudice and threads turn inflammatory and become very unpleasant to read. We all know we should be keeping our own political views out of forum posts.

I know people have had these kinds of warning plenty of times before - in future any post that contains unnecessarily inflammatory remarks (or unnecessarily disrespectful remarks to other posters) will simply be removed in full.

deb

i hear what you are saying, but don't you think a persons subjective take on things, colours how they read the astrology? i see it all the time in others, and in fact astrology has so much subjectivity to it already, it is hard to know what is objective and what is subjective...

at any rate.. that's fine.. if it comes out in the future, it will be by accident and i will strive to self censor in this world of rampant censorship.. cheers james

oh, and if you have any insights on this preferred tool of yours - primary directions - that would be great to hear about with regard to nicola sturgeon.. thanks..

Thank you

astrology has so much subjectivity to it already, it is hard to know what is objective and what is subjective...

It is hard, but I think that one of the most important attributes of any kind of mundane analysis is to recognise our own bias and do everything possible to account for it. A few years ago I wrote an analysis of Trump's chart and asked my husband to read it. He said "what I can see from that is that you don't like Donald Trump". I argued that everything I wrote was based on the astrology, not my personal opinion, and he told me to look again, because everything I had identified as a character fault was a quality that someone who supported him would see as a strength. He was right. I at least try to write astrological analysis now in such a way that it would be hard for someone to know my own political view - that's a good way to explore the symbolism from different angles, free from the stuff that I am programmed to see or expect to see based on ingrained emotive feeling or media reports.

Anyway, it is enough to say "I am not a fan" if you want to declare some kind of opinion/bias, and leave it at that.

if you have any insights on this preferred tool of yours - primary directions

I realise I recently mentioned a liking for primary directions as a background tool in the thread on Tina Turner, but I haven't made any kind of fuss over that technique personally, and wouldn't call it my preferred tool. When I posted in this thread I had looked at her solar return, and don't have time to explore further than that myself.

thanks deb.. that is all good and i appreciate the personal story in it as well.. cheers james

I like to compare techniques in astrology.

Primary directions is a technique I have studied for a couple of years, and is fascinated with them.

As I have said earlier on threads here the problem with them is the exactness of birthtime required to use the Primary directed angles. But that is similar to use progressed angles in secondary progressions or in Solar arc of course where big errors in timing can occur when the birthtime is off.

There is also the style in which the tools are employed which differs from astrologer to astrologer. It is a very old technique and most users do it from that perspective of applying the rules of traditional astrology. Perhaps using only the visible planets. Using only the ptolemaic aspects et.c.
That is a choice and opinions differ..

I have a background in modern astrology so I tend to go there as well. But I see that many things in the traditional technique of Primary directions do work with the outer planets as well. And when it comes to aspects William Lilly used sesquisquares and semisquares in his work which the traditionalists don't do normally. I like the openmindedness of astrologers like Anthony Louis who don't close doors to modern ways while still being knowledgeable of the old rules.

In the case of Nichola Sturgeon for me that is a case where timetested modern technique does work in Primary direction in the case of this disgrace in her career.

In her Natal chart we see that saturn is squaring the MC from the 7th house. This explain the career problems she undergoing now to some extent with her husband (7th saturn) seems to being part of the problem in this scandal ( I am not so familiar about the facts here).

And this natal Saturn is activated by transit Uranus conjunct natal saturn showing disruptions and challenges in that area now. This is also present in her Solar return 2022-2023 ( not the one Deb talked about). Where both node and Uranus was on her natal Saturn 7th in the Return covering her resignation and the scandal with arrest et,c.

So for the progressed MC in solar arc in longitude, used by many for the progressed MC it is on the 12th cusp Alchabitius, but is not making any aspect in the chart.

But with the primary directed MC there is an exact quincunx to saturn in 7th house (There is a natal aspect saturn MC and repeating aspects in progression does activate it.) This is a principle that is very true with other directions in modern astrology, and it seems to work with primary directed MC as well.


Here is a pic from Janus with primary directions in the outer wheel.
This PD MC-150-SA is with an orb of 0'04 from exact.


That principle where planets involved with MC natally gets triggered by directed MC does show it coming alive.

.


Just to illustrate this principle with another chart with a good birthtime. The Swedish king Carl Gustaf
https://www.astro.com/astro-databank/Ca ... _of_Sweden

He was king at a very early age in his 20ies and have done his duty as King even though he was not in the mood to be king. Wanted more to party and enjoy fast cars et.c.

He have a powerful Jupiter conjunct his IC showing his fine ancestry and living in beatiful mansions . He was king in september 1974.

By Primary direction Converse PD MC quincunx his natal Jupiter activating the natal MC Jupiter aspect.

When the Primary directed MC in direct motion was quincunxing the very same Jupiter two years later in june 1976 on IC he had a big Public Marriage event with the German girl Silvia who became the Queen of Sweden and subsequently the crown princess Victoria was born next year.

Here is the direct primary directions for 1976 june:

Stefan wrote...

Primary directions is a technique I have studied for a couple of yerars and is fascinatied by them.As I have said earlier on threads here the problem with them is the exactness of birthtime required to use the Primary directed angles. But that is similar to use progressed angles in secondary progressions or in Solar arc of course where big errors in timing can occur when the birthtime is off.

Very true Stefan!
At the same time, it is a good tool to rectify a chart.
Primary directions are not any different than using Secondary Progressions or Solar Arc except...
One aspect in Primary Direction is enough to generate an event. More often, you hear astrologers saying that you need multiple factors for something to happen. Which, in my view, is a way to say that predictive systems are not flawless or reliable enough.
Talking about Secondary progressions, the Sun is very reliable in producing major events in life and if you think about it... it is a Converse Primary Direction of the Sun. Try to do the same thing with the Secondary Progression Moon and you will see many hits of the Moon being eventful. The Moon here seems to have a general influence but more so in the Moon Phase like NM, FM and QM to define the bigger picture of one's life.
Traditional astrology is a master art but modern astrology (if it can defined?) incorporates new elements that did not exist as if the message was a path to evolution (starting with Outer planets, Uranian astrology, Anthroposophy, Asteroids and more). And it all leads to 'individualization' of each person on Earth as opposed to reading the chart of a King to get the destiny of a nation.

Best to you,
Ouranos

am i the only one noticing that a lot of politicians today aren't that honourable?

hey stefan

thanks! that is a very good response on the use of primary directions that i was hoping to get from the well known public astrologer here at skyscript that advocates for them - martin.. i suppose he is busy and has better things to do..

i am like you and interested in using techniques that work and are reliable.. i am not convinced of using primary directions thru the bounds, something martin has advocated for.. some of this is because i don't know the logic to the bounds and of course there are 3 different systems of 'bounds' or terms to choose from.. i prefer to do as you have done here and consider modern techniques like the quincunx you've used to arrive at a symbolic primary direction that fits with sturgeons fall from grace - midheaven - saturn connection..

below is the chart showing the primary directions for this time frame.. i get quincunx - 150 saturn directed to the midheaven for april 20, 2023.. there is also the 90 of saturn to uranus in the same month which does tie into the transits you also mention of uranus on the natal saturn in sturgeons chart.. quoting wikipedia -

"Large speculation that Sturgeon could be arrested for police questioning amid the ongoing inquiry[332][333][334] came to fruition when, on 11 June 2023, Sturgeon was arrested by Police Scotland over the investigation into the finances of her SNP party, which reportedly diverted £600,000 meant for the Scottish Independence campaign elsewhere.[335][336][337] She was released without charge pending further investigation later that day."

the timing is fairly close to the actual event of her arrest using the 150 aspect with primary directions.. thanks stefan!

Your supposition is correct, James. Although I try to check in briefly most days, for personal reasons I have had very little time to post over the past two months, and the situation is likely to continue for several months more (much as I'd prefer it not to). Also, I'm past trying to convince anyone, especially if they have already read hundreds of pages of my best efforts to express myself coherently on a topic and remain unconvinced. Life is too short.

Just as a brief comment, though, the first question to ask, in my opinion, is what elements in Sturgeon's chart set her up for this sort of trouble in the first place. I haven't studied her chart closely, but the two things that jump out, from a sidereal perspective, are the Sun (sect light, chief significator of status) conjunct a fallen Mars (ruler of the 2nd and 7th: money and spouse) and a fallen Saturn in the 7th. Both are currently activated.

'You know my methods, Watson. Apply them.'

lol! martin! - thank you.. yes, you're correct.. i would suggest you get off that lazyboy coach you are reclined on and get to work, but i suppose that isn't going to happen, as you are already there - working, working, working!

i appreciate your response.. thank you.. and i agree with your observations off the sidereal chart of sun-mars conjunction in cancer having some bearing on this.. saturn in the 7th in aries certainly fits what is coming out now on her husband.. it is all connected regardless... how much of it is her and how much of it is her husband - hard to know.. people get in relationships with others for a reason..

here is only one of the many conundrums i find when considering this particular example using stefans guideline as outlined above...

the primary key one uses makes a significant difference... ptolemy will give a better response here then naibod.. i did this by doing her age - approx 53 -x 3.9 for the naibod key and x 4 for the ptolemy key.. it shows a very close 150 midheaven to saturn using the ptolemy key... but again - how does one use this in a predictive and quantitative way in advance??

here are the 2 charts showing the different keys used via this method stefan introduced in the previous exchange a week or so ago at skyscript..

first one is using the 'ptolemy' key..



this one is using the 'naibod' key... it was the reverse the last time - naibod key lined up more closely and the ptolemy key was more off in terms of time..