Jason wrote: Sun Sep 10, 2023 12:14 pm Hats off to you for putting yourself out here.

Hi Jason, thank you but really, not much to crow about, I've got no reputation to lose, not being a professional astrologer or an academic, and I'm old enough to not care much any more about how I look for admitting to errors, we all make them, and maybe revealing mine will save others the odd misstep.

Jason wrote:Reading over your analysis, I can follow along with your line of reasoning. Not being especially fluent in these charts yet, I had the simple, rapid, first impression that both benefics being angular with Venus pushing virtue to Jupiter in what would be the 7th house competitor's derived 10th, looked good for whoever was 7 - additionally, the Moon in its domicile close to the 7th cusp has dignity there and in Taurus (derived 10) but how to assess who was 7? That's an area I'm still in the dark on.

lol...you and me both!

Jason wrote:It's the only way to learn. And it's great to have some comrades to discuss with along the way.

Yes, in fact, it might be the only way we truly learn anything. Discussion is good, helps to keep the mind's wheels oiled.

Jason wrote:I've got errands to run and other stuff to work on/research, but if I utilize my time wisely, I might try to deliver my own analysis on one of the games set for later today. We'll see how that goes.

Looking forward to reading it.

Janegca,
We share the old age and the reputation not to care about.
And I prefer your commitment to wavering.
Please post any other chart from this tournament if you have any.

Ouranos

Well, here we go. One day later, September 10, 2023, and the exact same start time 4:19PM EDT Arthur Ashe Stadium, Flushing, NY As I noted in an earlier post, key change is Moon now at 1 Leo, so no longer strong in domicile.
Djokovic served first so I would give him the first and Saturn (L1) and Medvedev the Moon (L7).
So, IF Djokovic wins, as the "older" player will it clarify what happened yesterday (would be easier to work out if Medvedev served first, the Universe is not cooperating).

Going solely on the significators being descriptive of the players, the Moon (if it did belong to Gauff, the younger player) was strong as L7 in her own domicile in the 7th. The same only partially applies for Medvedev, he is the younger of the two; the Moon is still in and ruling the 7th BUT she is not in her own domicile, so loses some strength.

Also, as yesterday, the Moon is still separating from the Sun (which would go to L1 and Djokovic) and applying to Mars (which will go to L7 and Medvedev).

There are new aspects today which may be interesting to watch in connection with the 8th (accidents, injuries, and reportings according to Brady):

• Mercury is in a mitigated partile semi-sextile (so power of conjunction) with Mars. Mercury rules the 5th (games) and 6th (injury). According to Brady, for battle charts, the 5th is "team morale" and the 6th is "the ability to move the ball". Mercury is retro but strong in his own domicile. Thinking back to yesterday's game, both players moved the ball very well, Sabalenka got down on herself far more than Gauff did
• the Moon was square Mars yesterday, which perhaps was not the strength I thought it was but a true impediment. Today it is sextile.
• Saturn is in partile opposition to the 8th House cusp, that was not true yesterday. Will the crowd turn against Djokovic? Normally they don't like Medvedev.
  
  Time to go back to the game and see how it plays out.

Ouranos wrote: Sun Sep 10, 2023 5:40 pm Janegca,
We share the old age and the reputation not to care about.
And I prefer your commitment to wavering.
Please post any other chart from this tournament if you have any.

Ouranos

Hi Ouranos, yes, being old and grumpy (at least, I can be, don't mean to imply you are) has its advantages I did watch one other game today, the Women Doubles final. Will post the chart in a bit.

As we speak, 2 sets have been played and Djokovic leads 2-0

Djokovic first serving and older - Lower part of the chart
Medvedev - upper part

2 planets aspecting the Angles
- Sun trine AS sextile VII - Sun upper part (Advantage Medvedev)
- Venus squares MC/IV - Venus in 7th (Advantage Medvedev)
--------------
Aspects between planets
MoonL7 in 7 quincunx SaturnL1 in 1 (Tie)
This is the most important aspect to consider here
And the PF is tied to both
PF squares Saturn (Djokovic) trine Moon (Medvedev)
A contest between a square and a trine. Who wins? If I go by the book, Medvedev would be the winner but it looks like I have 2 strikes against me right now.

The Men's final went much longer 3hr 18min, finished at 7:37pm. And Djokovic, who served first, won, so there goes my idea about descriptiveness. Have to assume I have misread the conditions around the 7th so going back to the drawing board and trying to stick to basics and giving credit to Bonatti and his sources, I will stick with L1 going to the challenger

Women's Final
Gauff having first serve = challenger
L1 ruled by Saturn (superior planet) at 2 PI (dignity of face) retrograde (weakens) in 2nd (succedent)
Moon is separating from Sun in Virgo, 7th from Saturn so angular -- strong will power?
Saturn does not apply to any planet so gains nothing
Pluto in the 1st, -- gives resourcefulness?
Judgment: intrinsically strong (superior planet, face) but with moderate strength (retro, succedent) having access to a strong will and resourceful

Sabalenka
L7 ruled by the Moon (inferior planet) at 19 CA (domicile) in 7th (angular)
Moon is applying by square to Mars in Libra (detriment) in 2nd from Moon (succedent) -- energy, combativeness?
(If outers are used, Moon is applying to Uranus in 10th (angular) from Moon -- erratic play?)
Venus in the 1st -- mildness (not enough fight in them?)
Judgment: intrinsically weak (inferior planet) with quality skills (domicile) and good strength (angular) but tends to be mild (with Venus) and given to erratic play (I'm going with Uranus here)

Outcome: Gauff (L1) won the match.

Men's Final
The charts are almost exactly the same expect for:
Djokovic as serving first = challenger
Moon is applying to Pluto instead of the Sun, gains from inner resourcefulness, as Pluto also in 1st (11th from Saturn) -- effectively resourceful?

Medvedev
Moon is applying to Mars in Libra (detriment) in 2nd (succedent) -- moderately (succedent) aggressive (Mars) but ineffective (detriment)

Outcome: Djokovic [L1] won the match

Now one thing I did notice that might have played to L1's favour was the fact that L1 in the 2nd is in the 7th's 8th and both L7's (Sabalenka and Medvedev) needed at least one medical time out while I don't recall either of Gauff or Djokovic taking one. Almost as if their play wore down their opponents bodies.

The third chart is of the Women's Doubles Final, it is a little more straight forward Play was between Dabrowski/Routhliffe (D/R) and Siegemund/Zvorareva (S/Z), the match took 2hrs and 14minutes.
D/R - served first
L1 Jupiter (superior planet) 15 TA (term) in 6th (cadent) and retrograde (weak)
Moon separating from Pluto in 9th from Jupiter (cadent, retro) -- gives some resourcefulness ?
Jupiter is not applying to any planet
Judgment: intrinsically strong (superior) good skills (term) and somewhat (cadent, retro) resourceful but not very strong (cadency)

S/Z
L7 Mercury (inferior planet) 9 Virgo (domicile) in 9th (cadent) with Sun (combust) and retrograde (weak)
Moon applying sextile Mars in Libra (detriment) in 2nd (succedent) from Mercury -- gives moderate (succedent) energy (Mars) but ineffective (detriment)
Mercury is applying to the opposition of Saturn in Pisces (face) in the 7th (angular), from Mercury, retrograde (weak) -- malefic strong (angular) in opponents house (7th) causes difficulties
Judgment: intrinsically weak (inferior planet) with quality skills (domicile) but almost completely ineffective (combust, retro, cadent); struggles against opponents

Outcome: D/R [L1} win the match

And now calling it a night.

Jason wrote: I might try to deliver my own analysis on one of the games set for later today. We'll see how that goes.

I did find my copy of Frawley's Sports Astrology yesterday but ended up down the rabbit hole after thumbing through it and reading posts on the links the two of you provided. I realize now it's going to take some serious dedication, time, and experimentation to get the hang of these charts. Had a good laugh at myself for thinking I might be able to just jump right in: "Sure, buddy." lol

Thanks for posting about the matches this weekend. I read the analyses multiple times, slowly. It's good to have them recorded here for reference.

I did find my copy of Frawley's Sports Astrology yesterday but ended up down the rabbit hole after thumbing through it and reading posts on the links the two of you provided. I realize now it's going to take some serious dedication, time, and experimentation to get the hang of these charts. Had a good laugh at myself for thinking I might be able to just jump right in: "Sure, buddy." lol

I agree with you Jason.
How simple would it be to find the most elevated planet to determine the winner!
And I like to put my knowledge (or ignorance!) to the test.
Astrology is like one day you can be a catholic and the next day a muslim. When you find something that works!
In games of sports, I like to view all planets as equal and to keep it simple.
Angles and tight orbs. And who rules what.
In the match between Djokovic and Medvedev, my focus was on the quincunx between Moon and Saturn both ruling the players and giving the edge to Medvedev. But I should have gone one step further and see that the Moon was in the face of Saturn (Djokovic).

Anyway, I enjoyed the exercice and the fun we had.

Ouranos

janegca wrote: Mon Sep 11, 2023 1:38 am
Women's Final
Gauff having first serve = challenger
L1 ruled by Saturn (superior planet) at 2 PI (dignity of face) retrograde (weakens) in 2nd (succedent)
Moon is separating from Sun in Virgo, 7th from Saturn so angular -- strong will power?
Saturn does not apply to any planet so gains nothing
Pluto in the 1st, -- gives resourcefulness?
Judgment: intrinsically strong (superior planet, face) but with moderate strength (retro, succedent) having access to a strong will and resourceful

Sabalenka
L7 ruled by the Moon (inferior planet) at 19 CA (domicile) in 7th (angular)
Moon is applying by square to Mars in Libra (detriment) in 2nd from Moon (succedent) -- energy, combativeness?
(If outers are used, Moon is applying to Uranus in 10th (angular) from Moon -- erratic play?)
Venus in the 1st -- mildness (not enough fight in them?)
Judgment: intrinsically weak (inferior planet) with quality skills (domicile) and good strength (angular) but tends to be mild (with Venus) and given to erratic play (I'm going with Uranus here)

Outcome: Gauff (L1) won the match.

I'm at work but had to jump on here and share something that popped up in my newsfeed. Now, no-one would have known this would be captured on video after the match, but it does seem to align nicely with your comments about some of Mars & Uranus' possible effects on Sabalenka, Janegca.

Sabalenka smashes racket

Ouranos wrote: Mon Sep 11, 2023 10:42 am
Astrology is like one day you can be a catholic and the next day a muslim. When you find something that works!

Btw, great analogy here Ouranos. lol I absolutely agree.

Ouranos wrote: Mon Sep 11, 2023 10:42 am I agree with you Jason.
How simple would it be to find the most elevated planet to determine the winner!

If only!

Ouranos wrote: And I like to put my knowledge (or ignorance!) to the test.

Yes, so do I. In fact, I'm going to start another thread on baseball, the Jays have a 4 game series with Texas starting tonight. I've cleaned up my old Bonatti notes and will try them out.

Ouranos wrote: Astrology is like one day you can be a catholic and the next day a muslim. When you find something that works!

So true.

Ouranos wrote: In games of sports, I like to view all planets as equal and to keep it simple.
Angles and tight orbs. And who rules what.
In the match between Djokovic and Medvedev, my focus was on the quincunx between Moon and Saturn both ruling the players and giving the edge to Medvedev. But I should have gone one step further and see that the Moon was in the face of Saturn (Djokovic).

Anyway, I enjoyed the exercice and the fun we had.

There is always so much to look at, sticking to basics and identifying the key elements is always tough for me but It has been fun.

Jason wrote: I did find my copy of Frawley's Sports Astrology yesterday but ended up down the rabbit hole after thumbing through it and reading posts on the links the two of you provided. I realize now it's going to take some serious dedication, time, and experimentation to get the hang of these charts. Had a good laugh at myself for thinking I might be able to just jump right in: "Sure, buddy." lol

I've taken a stab at it every few years; but as you said, it takes dedicated study and life always manages to interfere. Who knows how long I'll last at it this time

Jason wrote: Mon Sep 11, 2023 2:06 pm I'm at work but had to jump on here and share something that popped up in my newsfeed. Now, no-one would have known this would be captured on video after the match, but it does seem to align nicely with your comments about some of Mars & Uranus' possible effects on Sabalenka, Janegca.

Gauff figured out Sabalenka's basic game in the 2nd set and you could see it was frustrating Sabalenka, she kept trying what usually works for her only it wasn't working. Do have to give her credit for waiting until she was out of the spotlight to blow.