And before anyone asks; Yes I have read Patricia Cornwells book this weekend! :-) I got rather tired of Henry VIII. Just a charming, brutal "Cry-Baby". AND I do not like his father after reading Joshepine Tey :-)

I do not really know what to think about this book. PC:s I mean. It seams that the evidence is rather thin I must say.

So I wonder; is it at all possible to use astrology to solve the case? Was any astrologer involved at the time? Or since?

I have no acsess to Sickert's birth data (and somehowe I doubt that one could look at a natal chart and really see if the person is a murderer) so I did a horary of the "first" murder. That of Mary Ann Nichols, using the time of the discovery of the body; August 30 1888, 3.45 am London.

Asc ruler is Sun placed in the 1:st house. 7:th house ruler Saturn placed in the 12:th. But would you use the 7:th house ruler as a Significator of the Murderer in this case? Or the 12:th house ruler (Moon)? Or even maybe the 10:th (Venus)?

Best Regards/Anna (Many, many thanks for the feedback regarding the Combustion-Question! It helped a lot!)

Hi Tom!

I like your timing better than the noon-chart I did on Sickert when I was reading the book. It did not make very much sence. Although there was a square between Mars and the Moon. But I have that one myself and I have not murdered anyone. Yet. :-) Sickert also has Mercury conjunct Algol.

I would believe in a Taurus rising. Somewhere I have read that Taurus-rising is the prime-sign of Psycopaths as Capricorn-rising is the prime-sign of Con-men/women. I do not remember where so it is not veryfied in any way.

Note that the chart of the murder of Mary-Ann Nichols has the MC in Taurus.

And yes, this is when astrology is really fun! Otherwise it is most work and feelings and problems. :-) Many thanks/Anna

Hi, Tom

I was interested in your quote from this older thread because I have been looking into the use of Marks, Moles, and Scars per Lilly as a method of chart rectification. Thanks for the fascinating background!

Walter Richard Sickert's birth data is in the book, sans birth time on page 41 of the hardbound edition: May 31, 1860, Munich Germany. Sickert sufferred three life threatening surgeries most likely without anesthesia, on his genitals, when he was quite young.

There is no guarantee, of course, that the surgeries Sickert sustained as an infant are indicated on his birth chart. But if they were, they might be found as the Mark of the Moon, the Mark of the Ascendant, or the Mark of the Sixth house cusp, per Lilly. In decumbitures, I have more than once found surgical marks to be represented on the cusp of the sixth house. This is true, in fact, on my own birth chart as well.

May 31, 1860
4:38 AM
Munich, Germany
Regiomontanus

This chart puts the Part of Fortune on the cusp of the sixth house, in Scorpio, the area which would indicate the genitals according to Lilly's instructions on "Moles, Marks, and Scars". Do we know what the surgery was intended to correct? This sort of information might help us pin down the placement of the Sixth House cusp in early or late Scorpio. It also shows the Moon applying to a square to Mars, possibly indicating surgery.

Do you know of any other identifying marks that were reported of Sickert?

Warmest,

Pam

Caleb Carr, author of The Alienist, offers an explanation of Cornwell's suggestions of surgery, which can be read on this site:

http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.h ... gewanted=2

Caleb Carr:

Cornwell notes that as a boy Sickert underwent several surgeries to correct a ''fistula'' of some kind. If that fistula was penile, Cornwell posits, then the three painful surgeries could -- provided they were failures -- have left Sickert genitally deformed, impotent and incapable of having children, all of which would indeed be rich soil out of which to grow a frustrated sexual predator. Therefore, Cornwell simply decides that not only was Sickert's fistula in fact penile, but that the surgeries were bungled. Small matter that the surgeon who performed the procedures was an expert in rectal and venereal diseases, and that there is no record of his ever having performed surgery for a penile fistula on anyone. Even smaller matter that, later in life, one of Sickert's friends would scold him for fathering illegitimate children, or that at least one of those alleged children would eventually turn up. No, the penile deformity is postulated, and very soon it is treated for all practical purposes as a fact.

If the surgery were rectal, we would expect to find Mars below the Earth
(scar is in the back, not the front of the body). The scar would be in late degrees of Scorpio. This would suggest a chart ascendant of approximately 29 Scorpio at 6:48 pm. Part of Fortune is on the cusp of the fifth house, suggesting competence in an artistic field. The Moon is now separating from Mars.

Too bad we have no other marks to work with. . .ordinarily, I would vaildate this mark with at least two others; one for the Ascendant or Lord of the Ascendant, and one for the Moon.

The Lilly material on Moles, Marks and Scars is on p. 148 of Christian Astrology

Warmly,

Pam

I once attended a study day on this very subject at the Tate Gallery so I already know the answer (if you will pardon the impious conceit). The most important "evidence" discussed was the authorship of letters to newspapers claiming to be Jack and the similarity of the drawing style to Sickert's notebooks.

Looking at the 04:11 chart I can see more than one close conjunction to fixed stars but have not corrected their positions to 1860.Mercury is rising above the Sun and has entered Gemini but has just been zapped by that powerful Mars and Neptune who is in a bound(Egyptian) of Saturn and is next heading for Uranus.

Using whole sign houses I was amused to see that the sixth house of illness is Scorpio - tradtional ruler of the genitals

I still have my copy of Cornwall's book, and I'll check out what I can when I return, but:

No, the penile deformity is postulated, and very soon it is treated for all practical purposes as a fact.

"Ripperologists" are always a bit more than nasty when someone postulates a solution for the crime. After all, once the crime is solved they have nothing to do. Robert Graysmith has been treated to similar sarcasm in the Zodiac murder cases. But for the record not all penile fistula surgery would leave the patient impotent and unable to have children, if successful. A bungled one might, and bungling surgery in an era that did not use anesthesia might be easy, particularly if the surgeon was expert in other types of surgery. And the physician would not want a record of his mistakes to survive. All of this of course is speculation, but when authors try to dispute the work of others with little more than sarcasm, they aren't to be taken too seriously.

I'll recheck the book. The original post was three years ago. What is going on in the cosmos to resurrect it?

Tom

Hi, Tom

I don't think I'd better speak for the Cosmos, but for myself, I am looking at ways to rectify a chart using Lilly's "Moles, Marks and Scars".

If you know anyone who would care to contribute to a study I'm conducting here on this forum, perhaps you would be so kind as to refer them here:

http://skyscript.co.uk/forums/viewtopic.php?t=2834

Smile

Pam