granny_skot wrote:LOL since when do you listen to astronomers as to what a planet is,

I was joking.

granny_skot wrote: my pluto is trine my venus and I dont have any desire to do such interesting things to myself, my Chiron on the other hand is almost Opposed to Pluto and Sextile Venus so maybe that is part of the difference.

granny

Well if you can tell from one's chart, where they may have a scar or tattoo, then I'd love to see the chart of one of these people who have their entire bodies and faces tattooed. THat would be very interesting to read.

RC

I've used Lilly's "scars, moles and warts" locating technique to reasonable success in the location of tattoos and piercings. These days in a Western country people generally are less prone to scars or deformities due to improved medicine and better health etc. For example, I was born with twisted ankles, highlighted by my afflicted Sun in Pisces and Aquarius rising, but after a couple of corrective bandages for the first few weeks of life I'm perfectly normal. In a 3rd world country I would have been a cripple! Same thing with people's teeth. Lilly says Jupiter rising in a water sign gives bad teeth - well I would have had very bad teeth, but I got a brace free on the NHS and now they're lovely and straight!

Bascially, I have found that people, generally speaking, are more likely to get an area highlighted by this technique pierced or tattooed than any other area. Of course the rules don't always work, but I have had some very interesting direct hits. For example my male friend has his Moon in Cancer, and his only tattoo is on his chest, at about the right height for the number of degrees his Moon is at. Also he pierced the nipple on the same side I also know a girl with Moon in Leo who has a tattoo across the bottom of her back. I also successfully guessed a girl having a tattoo on the inside of her right thigh (Moon in the 2nd house in Sag, Jupiter in masculine sign!).

As to what planetary influence is leading this self-mutilation trend, I'm not sure. It seems very Martian. I can't take it too seriously though, it is just a fad though - people feel this need to shock somehow. With the really bizarre body mods, I just think people go out of their way to do something "unique", for the sake of it. In the West we do have the "cult of the individual", after all... (I also think boredom and an overly-large disposable income has something to do with it too )

I think the rules for scar location are on this site somewhere - if not, I can post them and we can have a bit of fun guessing where people's scars, moles and tattoos are!!

Keren

kerenhappuch wrote:
I think the rules for scar location are on this site somewhere - if not, I can post them and we can have a bit of fun guessing where people's scars, moles and tattoos are!!

Keren

If you know the link, I'd love to see it.

RC

Looking for that might keep her busy for a while, because I don't think there is one.

we can have a bit of fun guessing where people's scars, moles and tattoos are!!

I'm interested in this. I never knew my father's birth time, but he had a tattoo on his right arm. He was a sailor during WWII - it was expected. It might help with a rectification.

Tom

lol. Okay. I have three prominent scars on my body, how about I send you my birth data and you guess where they are, I'll tell you right now I have Moon in Leo and No tattoo on my person!

too keep it fair I could tell Deb in advance where the scars are, actually a couple smaller ones as well so I'll tell her all those in advance and you see if you can figure them out? what do you think?

granny who lives in a modern Age and still has scars, though I have lived to tell the tales! and there have been a few escapades that shoulda killed me....

granny_skot wrote:lol. Okay. I have three prominent scars on my body, how about I send you my birth data and you guess where they are, I'll tell you right now I have Moon in Leo and No tattoo on my person!

too keep it fair I could tell Deb in advance where the scars are, actually a couple smaller ones as well so I'll tell her all those in advance and you see if you can figure them out? what do you think?

granny who lives in a modern Age and still has scars, though I have lived to tell the tales! and there have been a few escapades that shoulda killed me....

That might be fun. I'd try. It would be also interesting to have a look at that guy you mentioned with the forked tongue. You wouldn't happen to have his birth data?


RC

Seriously not on the site? I thought it was. Ah well...

We base our predictions on sign, dispositor and house position. I'll try not to leave anything out...

Each sign rules an area of the body, from Aries = head down to Pisces = feet. The place on that part is shown by the degrees eg. 12 Sag mid-thigh, 29 Sag pretty close to the knee, 05 Capricorn the top of the knee etc.

The house shows whether it's on the front or easily visible, eg. On MC - slap bang in the middle, top or front of the body part, IC behind or underneath, Asc on side close to body, Desc on the outer side.

The sign of the dispositor shows which side of the body part, i.e. feminine sign = left side, masculine sign = right.

I'll include some examples at the end!

We look at the following points:

1. Asc

2. Asc ruler

3. Moon

4. 6th cusp

5. 6th ruler

Not forgetting of course general indications such as Mars rising gives a scarred face, Sun gives freckles etc...

Eg. my chart: 12 Aquarius rises, with Saturn in Sag on the MC. I have a largeish freckle halfway down my right shin that's visible through sheer tights. Aquarius = lower leg, 12 degrees = about half way down, dispositor in masculine sign = right shin, dispositor on MC = right in the middle of the front of my shin!

Lord 1 at 09 Sag, disposited by Jupiter in Pisces:
Left (dispositor in feminine sign) thigh (Sag), close to the top (09 degrees), inside leg (dispositor under horizon in 1st house). And I do indeed have a mole there!

Now here's an easy one one to get you started: My mother has Moon in mid-Leo (though we have no time so no house position), disposited by Sun in Capricorn - where is her scar?

Get it? It's a brilliant party trick - when it works....

Sorry to those I'm offending by using astrology in such a superficial way - but it can be quite a good tool for shutting up those annoying skeptics who are adamant that astrology is make-believe when you tell them as a complete stranger that they have a big black mole on the inside of their right thigh LOL!

Apparently Lilly used this method with his skeptical horary clients too, using the horary Asc to show the client's scars/moles - any volunteers to try it?!!

Keren

I have wanted his data since i first met the brat but unfortunately he wont give it up... yet... If I ever get it I will tell the info.

birth info

13 April 1962
Los Angeles Ca
6:07 pm

you will know you have it right if you get moon in 10th house at 18 Leo 45 and
asc 21 Libra 14 (sorry just realized I put leo in there )

sending deb the scar list for accuracy sake
And Deb has the Scar list now so feel free to take a stab at it! Pun intended

Granny

Decorating the body, with or without piercing or needles, indelibly and permanently, has been something we humans have been doing since we huddled in caves carving notches on bones as lunation markers. Adornment, as with all visual signals, such as trends and fashion, is a way of communicating. Not only can a look scare away ?outsiders?, but it also tells fellow tribal members the position and value of one?s personal standing in the community.

Tattooing is seen thematically in the horoscope with Mars as ruler of all things sharp that draws blood, being in aspect to Venus, Queen of embellishment, who, in her turn, is in aspect to Saturn, ruler of the skin, and/or, should a person create a great impact upon others, the collective planets, Uranus, Neptune and Pluto (and corresponding houses) will also play a part. The level of status of any tattooed individual, as seen through the eyes of the collective, would involve the Sun, Moon or Venus in aspect to Saturn and Pluto. (Chiron could well be in the astrological equation, but I am not sure how the need to ?overcome an obstacle?, i.e. what the wound represents, without it being in aspect to Venus).

Apart from circumstances where people slash and scar themselves because of a lack of Venusian self worth, an act which only reinforces their point of personal devaluation (and Mars/Chiron would surely be active in these kind of situations), it is generally true to say that to mark and/or scar one?s body is usually considered a rite of passage into adulthood. As the astrological Sun shows all that we identify with, and what we think looks good is Venus, it is Mars who cuts the Saturnian skin. The not-so-ancient Nubians are an extreme example of scarification, and the facial Maori Moko art shows a stunning historical illustration of how tribals demonstrate each person?s unique but common identity. So while the timing of most ceremonial rites would also be considered Saturnian, practices that involve the enhancing of outer appearances is Venus. The resurrection of inner-health, as well as the protection from and removal of unwanted spirits may well be the domain of Chiron -- but the inner-strength that is found by coming out the other side of tremendous pain -- has to, in my opinion, be attributed to a dominant Pluto, Scorpio, the 8th house, and its? ruler.

But I ought to mention how I am interested to see this question: not least because way back in 1976 I wrote my art school thesis on this very subject. The rebellious planet of change, Uranus, was transiting transformational Scorpio at the time (and aspecting my natal Venus ? although I wasn?t that astrologically aware), and with few reference books in Punk?s wild year, I spent months hanging out with various tattoo artists, always miraculously avoiding their needles. (Still successful to date! Although, I maintain the right to change my mind; should I ever end up on a Polynesian island under the watchful eye and trained hand of a Shaman who marks the body with a certain pattern, on a certain body part, at a certain time, in order to repair harm, heal, and protect the spirit).

What fascinates me, though, in the current world of tattoos is the proliferation of ?ancient? designs. Rather than a discreet little blue bird or rose, or even a sailor?s graffiti travelogue of visited ports and girl?s names, what we often see now is often a full body visual, male or female. En mass (probably the influence of Uranus, Neptune or Pluto passing through Scorpio; 1956-1995), whole swathes of people use body art as a means of communicating personal intention. Our world is one of constant change: and we regularly witness a representation longing for the past (the Moon), a homeland, family, or tribe to identify with (Moon and Sun), where the individual can establish and find their place in the clan - be it Celtic knots, Gothic spikes, fluffy fairies, a Hell?s Angel, an Indian?s Om, or Japanese Bushido, the tattoo - and act of scarification - is a personal message to the external world: consciously or unconsciously claiming to be apart but connected, declaring that they invincibly strong (Mars), someone who can withstand pain and (Pluto), currently, has an aesthetic beyond ?normal? fashionable Venusian conception: someone who is may be a rebel or dreamer and, potentially, masochistic. Therefore, when looking at those who use tattoos to make lasting statements, we must always look at The Lights in relation to Venus, Mars and Saturn, (and optional: Uranus for defiance, Neptune for illusion, and Pluto for pain), noting houses they fall into, (8th very probable) and the various hard aspects these planets create to each other. We must also always look at the various influences the tattooed admire and long to belong to, to really understand what gets under their Saturnian skin (sorry, it was an irresistible pun!).

Granny_skot, Your chap has ticked all the boxes for body art: Venus as chart ruler, and lord of the 8th. Sun/Mercury on the Decendant in Mars ruled Aries. Venus is in Taurus, in a tight and tough to carry Fixed Cross; Venus is in opposition to Neptune in Scorpio, and squares Saturn in Aquarius, and the Moon in Leo. Adding to the pain, a Jupiter /Chiron conjunction opposes Pluto in Virgo, which brings us full circle as Pluto trines the seventh house Venus, which is at home by sign and house; this is someone who has serious issues with authoirty, but thinks he looks great! Scorpio is also on the cusp of the 2nd. At least this helps you to undestand him a little better. Is he also an artist?

Hi Laura

Just wanted to thank you for the great info.

Welcome to the forum
Deb