Hello to All,

As this is my first post here, I hope I'm doing this right.

I cast a chart a few months ago asking about an old friend with whom there has not been any contact in a very long time (none in this century, actually). The question I asked was, "Does she ever think of me?"

Coordinates are 7e05, 50n44, November 9, 2007, 7.17 PM GMT. Chart has 14.24 Cancer rising, MC at 13.38 Pisces.

Still seeing her as a friend, despite there not having been any contact in such a long time (she also lives far away in another country), I used the 11th house to represent her. (Decided on this before casting the chart, to avoid falling prey to wishful thinking and choosing houses accordingly.)

She is thus represented by Mars in Cancer in the 12th house, closely behind the Ascendant, while my significator is the Moon in Scorpio in House 5. (While I am aware that 5th house mostly appears in questions surrounding romance, this is a same-sex friend with whom I am not, and was never, in love. However, it was an emotionally intense friendship, at least for me, and despite her being the older one, I felt rather protective of her, almost in a "parental" way somehow. I wonder if that might be one possible reason for the 5th house involvement here, as it is also the house of children...? If anyone has any other thoughts on this, or may even think the chart invalid due to house placement not being descriptive enough, please post.)

Both significators are very weak:
Mars in fall, albeit in its own triplicity, and moving very slowly, due to turn retrograde less than a week later. (It will therefore not reach the Ascendant, but turn retrograde and move away from it instead. Due to the physical distance, her suddenly "turning up on my doorstep" or any such thing is definitely out of the question, anyway.)
Moon, my significator, also in fall, PLUS combust the Sun, barely out of the Via Combusta, intercepted and moving into a square with Neptune (normally I try to ignore the outer planets as best I can, but wouldn't exclude the possibility of Neptune adding to the overall "mood" in this case). Hardly any worse state left for the Moon to be in!
Me as Moon being combust the Sun, and probably also the weakened state in general, seems to make sense, as I was very much afraid of the answer being a negative one, which was entirely possible given the amount of time that had passed since we last saw each other. (The reasons for contact breaking off are rather personal and would take too long to explain, though, so I would prefer not to elaborate on them here.)

As this is not a question about an event, but about "attitude/feelings" (such as, are there any feelings of friendship left from her side, has she forgotten me and is simply indifferent, or possibly even started disliking me, etc.), I decided to primarily look at receptions.
Going by receptions, both our significators are in each other's sign, which normally is a strong kind of reception. From this, the answer may look to be a "Yes, she does think of me", but - what I am wondering is this, hoping some of you who are more experienced with horary may be able to help me:

Does the fact that both our significators are in fall negate the positive elements of the mutual reception? I know that planets in weak condition are said to be lacking the strength to act in a positive way, but since the question was not about action, not about what was going to happen, but ONLY about existing attitudes/feelings, can the significators' weakness be neglected in order to arrive at an answer? Or do combustion, etc., render the chart ineffective EVEN in horaries that do not require an event?

Those of you who may use the outer planets, how would you see the role of Neptune in this case? Since the Moon is applying to a square of Neptune, would this indicate that I am not seeing things clearly? (Such as, maybe the answer to my question is a "No", after all, and I am not seeing this due to being too emotionally involved?)

Any and all thoughts are very welcome.(I was not going to post the chart at first, but after reading all kinds of things about combust significators, Via Combusta, etc., it kind of makes me doubt my own judgement, as I was probably too emotionally involved in this question to be even the least bit objective!)

Thanks in advance to anyone who takes the time to answer.

Student

Hi there,

I'll take a crack at it. Would you mind giving the actual location from whence you asked the question? I like the Astrodienst chart programs, but insofar as I know, I can only use city/country, rather than latitude/longitude (plus, they confuse me, those numbers with letters in between. )

However, I don't think Mars could have been in fall in November of 2007; Mars is now leaving Gemini to *enter* the sign of his fall, Cancer. He might have been in detriment if he was in Taurus at that time...but not fall.

Cheers,
GH

Hi
There may be others who may disagree but I'd consider the M/R here means that she does think about you; there's sympathy between you. So the simple answer to your question must be 'yes'. But as you wrote, the weakness of the sigs mean that neither of you are able or inclined to take any action. It also may mean some sort of mixed/confused emotions between you. The trine aspect between the sigs also indicates friendship.

I'd definitely ignore Nepture if it's not on an angle. Like Gunhilde, I'm unable to look at the chart without the location name.

Gem wrote:
I'd definitely ignore Nepture if it's not on an angle. Like Gunhilde, I'm unable to look at the chart without the location name.

Hi Gem,
with free program Astrowin by Allen Edwall you`ll be able to look at charts without location name. Sometimes it is very useful.

Best wishes,
Trojan

Thanks a lot everyone for your replies so far.

Okay, I'll give you the place, then. (Would have preferred to avoid doing so, but since it is highly unlikely anyone who knows both of us, or even the quesited herself, might be reading this, I suppose it won't hurt.)
Place is Bonn, Germany. The time zone is GMT +1 (question was thus asked at 8.17 PM local time), though I suppose Astrodienst or other astro programs would adjust automatically.

Gunhilde,

Mars was in Cancer last fall, then turned retrograde, moving all the way back into Gemini, and is soon to move back into Cancer again. If I remember correctly, it was at around 13 degrees of Cancer when it turned retrograde in the middle of November.

Am looking forward to reading your thoughts.

Gem,

Thanks a lot for offering your view on things. Regarding the mixed/confused emotions, I think you are on to something there. At least, that's how it feels from my side, and I suppose that, if she does think of me as you suggest, it would likely be similar for her. And you are also right about not feeling able/inclined to take any action at this time.

Thanks again!

Mars was in Cancer last fall, then turned retrograde, moving all the way back into Gemini, and is soon to move back into Cancer again. If I remember correctly, it was at around 13 degrees of Cancer when it turned retrograde in the middle of November.

Och! Of course, I had forgotten all about the Rx Mars; silly Gunhilde! This is what I get for not keeping an ephemeris to hand (and losing track of what month it is doesn't help, either ).

OK, now I'll go away and look at the chart, with all the information in front of me!

GH

horarcek said:
sometimes it is very useful

Yes it's very useful Thanks

Looking forward to Gunhilde's reading too

Hi,

My first thought is that while L1 and L11 are in orb of a trine, they are separating, indicating there has been contact between you in the past but that this is now coming to an end. The movement of the Moon into combustion is fitting - it makes me think of a "New Moon" in the way you are thinking/feeling about the situation. Perhaps asking the chart is a final resort for you, and now perhaps you are ready to move on.

So my verdict would be, yes there was a friendship there, but that contact between you both is coming/has come to an end.

Unless of course the immediate application of Mars to the Ascendant shows her contacting you! But since you cast this chart a while ago, I suspect this will not happen. As Gem pointed out, Mars is very weak and this shows that while she may be partly inclined to contact you (Mars on the Asc), she will not do so (Mars lacks essential dignity).

L11's position on the Asc may also show that from your point of view she has had all the power in the relationship, and that you felt you had to do things her way or go along with her wishes.

But after all - Mars in Cancer isn't a particularly nice person to be around - I'd rather have a different planet as my friend

Best wishes,

Keren

Thanks, Keren, for taking a look!

As for Mars on the Ascendant, it was already very slow on that date and turned retrograde less than a week later, thus preventing it from reaching the Ascendant. (Another hint that she is unlikely to contact me within the time frame given by the chart in question.)

Maybe the mutual reception, along with Mars' very slow forward movement, shows her to be in a sort of "wait-and-see" state in the matter, meaning she might be receptive if I were to contact her (Moon, my sig, and Sun, ruling my 3rd, both being received by Mars), but, as you say, she is unlikely to initiate contact herself. However, fitting the weakness of my own significator, I am not going to take any action any time soon, either.

Possibly the 12th house involvement also reflects my being in the dark about what her feelings/attitude towards me are at this point.
In a sense, both our significators are "hidden" from each other, her being in the 12th, and also on a point which a free chart program I downloaded a while ago refers to as the "Point invisible" (seems to be an Arabic part or something, though I had never heard of it before), while Moon is combust the Sun and in this sense also "hidden from view".

As for my being ready to move on - not sure... The Moon is placed towards the middle of the sign, as is the Ascendant, which might (but then, I could be wrong) hint at this not quite being the "end" yet. While I definitely see it as indicating that now is not the time to be taking any action in the matter, perhaps at some later point in time (symbolically when the Moon has undergone combustion and is "reborn"), after due reflection, renewed contact, maybe on a different basis somehow, would be possible...? (While I don't want to go into the details, in a nutshell, "communication" was a problem, including misunderstandings, and there are definitely things left unsaid, which may be one reason for our significators being in fall - quite fittingly, the Sun, by whom Moon is being "overwhelmed", rules the chart's 3rd.)

You say that Mars in Cancer isn't a particularly nice person to be around. The same could be said about the Moon in Scorpio, couldn't it? I think that these placements are probably more likely to show our inability to do anything about the matter, maybe also indicating unhappiness with the "ending" as it stands at this point. However, I dare say that neither she nor I is a "bad" person per se!
It was also not a friendship "just for fun", but went much deeper than that, in which sense Cancer/Scorpio energy seems rather fitting. (Mars/Scorpio might, of course, also reflect a certain amount of hurt/anger involved, although these feelings have not been able to silence the overall affection still felt. - While I can only speak for myself, of course, perhaps the mutual reception shows that it's not just me feeling this way, after all.)

Thanks again for your thoughts, you've definitely given me a few new things to think about! (Although I'm still worried about Neptune squaring the Sun and Moon, as well as some sources stating that the querent "can't see reason" when their significator is combust... )