I think that when approaching this topic it's as well to be aware that there is an awful lot of confusion out there with regard to exactly how autism and Asperger's should be defined.

I'm no expert on this so if I report something wrongly please do not hesitate to correct me. But I happened to be looking up the history of the terms on the Internet the other day, and noticed that the two terms had their origins in independent observations by two different doctors in different countries of particular sets of characteristics of behaviour and symptoms. Neither was apparently aware of the other's work. It was subsequently noticed that the two sets of behavioural and symptomatic characteristics thus separately described had much in common and just a few differences. It has therefore been argued that the two doctors might in fact have been observing the same core syndrome, but that one placed more subjective emphasis based on the particular observed characteristics of the patients he personally saw on some characteristics that the other did not count as a part of the syndrome he described, and vice versa. However, more recently the two terms, while they might originally have been describing more or less exactly the same core syndrome, have been adopted by modern doctors in slightly sharper mutual relief from each other. To what extent this modern distinction is purely a diagnostic convenience, based on an arbitrary and subjective scale on which patients presenting are analysed and lumped on one side or the other, is a question that has yet to be satisfactorily resolved as far as I am aware.

My wife knows this subject a lot more thoroughly than I do since she was herself diagnosed with an autistic spectrum condition in her early 30s, shortly before I met her - however, this diagnosis was based strictly on neurological tests and not arbitrary observations of social functioning. Apparently there has been research in this part of the world indicating that the common underlying feature of all true autistic spectrum conditions is a distinctly different physiology to the brain. This physiological difference is innate and presumed of genetic origin. Those who are born with it are likely to present a number of the possible observed symptoms associated with the autistic spectrum. Which ones, and how severe, will vary from case to case. But the most severe cases are thought to result from brain damage after birth. This is believed to be because those born with this different brain physiology are unusually vulnerable to environmental sources of brain damage, including chemicals. People born with the autistic brain may therefore be exceptionally sensitive to environmental toxins and need particular care exercised on their behalves when it comes to diet, air quality, and medicines, in order to avoid suffering early brain damage. Even those who do not suffer brain damage (my wife is a case in point - she has very, very few of the social symptoms conventionally associated with autism or asperger's syndrome) are likely to remain peculiarly sensitive to environmental and sensory stimuli throughout their lives because of their different brain physiology.

My wife is also adamant that autism and Asperger's that are diagnosed based purely on subjectively observed and assessed behaviour without neurological testing is liable to be erroneous, and that there may be many people who present some of the symptoms traditionally supposed to be connected with the condition but for completely unrelated reasons that have nothing to do with the autistic brain. She personally believes that the conditions are therefore greatly overdiagnosed.

She also says, interestingly, in relation to the controversy over whether or not vaccines such as the MMR vaccine might in some cases cause autism that it would be absolutely nonsensical to suggest they could, since people are either born with autism or not, and they would have to already have autism in the first place for conventionally 'autistic' symptoms resulting from any brain damage caused by chemical toxins in such vaccines (if present) to arise.

I supply this background only as some basic guidance in order that you are as clear as possible when it comes to definitions here.

Best regards,

Philip

Thanks Mike for the birth data (I just returned from holiday to find it).

Philip, you make very good points. It seems that half the people you know either have Asperger's or are bi-polar these days. Of course there is a wide range of severity of effects with autism/asperger's which complicates things further. And certainly we are diagnosing various conditions much more than we used to.

Preliminary findings of my meager sample (5 charts) are that all five have afflictions of one kind or another to the third house or its ruler. It makes sense to me that the social houses would be implicated. Also as Philip mentions, indications of hyper-sensitivities might be expected. All but one of these charts either has Neptune conjunct or opposed Sun or Moon or angular.

Charts I have so far :
- Oct.13/47, 12:01 am, Toronto, Canada
- July 9/73, 10:00 am, Tuam, Ireland
- Dec.29/86, 9:12 am, Chicago, USA
- April 20/89, 3:03 pm, Manchester, England
- July 10/90, 11:20 pm, 00W06 / 50N50

Tara

TARA!

The data I sent you should have read: -

- 9TH of July (not the 10th - sorry - error due to sloppy daylight-savings time conversion).

- LONG = 0w16 (not 0W06); (and LAT = 50n51, if you?re going to omit minutes.)

Mike

Tara,

A good friend has a grandson who has been diagnosed high achiever autistic or aspergers. This child is now 11 and to all appearances perfectly normal. But he has to eat food that is white in color and must not vary day to day. His daily time table must be set out in front of him at school and he attends a 'normal' school. He has a big interest in computer games. He has Sun and Mercury in 6th, with Moon in Virgo in 9th. Pluto in 12th in early Sag. Neptune 29 Cap and Uranus early Aquarius in 3rd - both retrograde. His nature is such that he thinks everyone is kind and gentle and he suspects nothing other than this even other children are unkind to him. He wants to hug them all.

Julie K

Thanks Julie K. Can you share his birth data?

Tara

Tara,

The b/d is June 12, 1997 Sydney - time I need to check, but you could work on 4.12 pm.

Julie K

Hi Tara,

Here is another Asperger's chart for you:

May 14/82
2:21 PM PDT
49N19 123W04

Biggest love is computer games. Also good at astrology especially horary.

Btw, there are indeed strong diagnostic tools for Asperger's, getting better all the time in fact. That might contribute to the large number of people being picked up by those looking.
I would be very interested to see what your findings are Tara! Strong air connections seems to be indicated?

Tara,Elli Fant,

I note an advertised program on ABC Ch. 1 on Thursday evening 'Catalyst' 8.00 pm AEST August 28th, 2008 where the number of terstosterone cells will be examined 'in utero' with relevance to Autism. Worth a look I think.

Julie K

Thanks Julie, I'll look out for that.

I don't know what to make of the whole topic of Asperger's and autism now, as someone here has commented, it seems practically everyone can end up being diagnosed from either one or the other now. I also came across some interesting remarks by anti-psychiatrist Dorothy Rowe, who does suggest that labelling a vulnerable introvert - especially within the family - serves practically the same purpose as hitherto labelling such people as schizophrenics - it demonises them. Here, Rowe follows the theories of Laing and Szasz.

As a child, I would imagine I would almost certainly have ended up with a label that would have put me comfortable within the autistic spectrum somewhere. Furthermore, the doctors blamed my parents - 'refrigerator mothers' and all that, so then there was lots of guilt in the equation to, which also did not help.

School was......well, let us just say, Chiron in the 3rd, conjunct Moon: 'nuff said. I teach now but mainly adults, it can be painful to work with children, where the demands of idiotic National Curriculums and demanding parents produce a more neurotic child to deal with each day.

Basically, what I am trying to say is that I do wonder what role all this popularity of these diagnoses might play, in a world where the demands of the workplace can place such huge expectations on people - uncomplaining at multi-tasking, superb social skills within the Team (being nice), whilst having competitive skills honed razor sharp (being totally ruthless when negotiating, ready to stab friends and colleagues in the back if necessary (being nasty, but still in a velvet glove):

I have a set of very close midpoints involving Moon, Mercury, Uranus Saturn and Midheaven, along with the Aries point too, which someone once told me incidentally, 'was the signature of the astrologer.' The first astrologers who saw my chart, however, seemed embarrassed to comment on all my horrendous afflictions.

If such things can be seen in the chart, then I do wonder to what purpose this knowledge might be applied. Something better than just making the said owner of the chart feel stigmatised, I would hope.

Could be, with more research and new knowledge, such definitions as 'asperger's' or 'autism' could undergo yet more sea changes, anyway. Many people, for example, may well be suffering in all sorts of subtle ways because of toxins in foods, other kinds of environmental pollution, for example.

Did anyone read the case studies on autism by Liz Greene and Erin O'Sullivan, by the way? If you did, what did you think of them?

Nexus7,

Can you let me know where these 'case studies' are to be found?

Thanks

The Astrology of Fate - Liz Greene
Dynasty. the astrology of family dynamics - Erin Sullivan