I haven't found this discussed elsewhere, if so, please direct me.

After decades of using Koch houses for modern-style character interpretation, and dabbling, very lightly in Horary using Louis' 1990 book, I was recently drawn into studying traditional natal techniques.

And ran smack into the problem that while using the Regiomontanus house system for my own chart gives me the same house placements for the planets as does Koch, even allowing planet 5 degrees from end of the house to go into the next, the Equal House system changes the house placement of Moon, North node. The Whole Sign system, which Robert Hand champions in his brilliant workshop on Reception, changes the house position of Sun, Moon, North Node, and Mars.

Given that the traditional and ancient techniques depend entirely on rulers of houses this puts me in something of a quandary.

I'm old enough that after having completed two Saturn returns the actual way my life unfolds is pretty clear. So you'd think it would be easy to pick which system is correct.

But it isn't. And the fact that I can make a good case for 5th house North Node and 6th House north node, 3rd House Moon or 4th, 8th house Sun or 9th, and 10th house Mars and 11th, mostly makes me question how much I am reading what I'd like to see into the chart, not what is.

So now I'm stymied about how to proceed with the application of the ancient techniques as there's no point in trying to do predictions until I feel confident in the house system I am using.

How do you handle this?

J-B Morin used regio for natal charts and he was aware of this quandary himself. He would say that a planet in the later degrees starts to influence the next house and may still influence the house that it is in. Most ancient techniques seem to start at the house, any planets in it and the house ruler so you may find the same planet used twice. It is in Book 18 of his Astrologia Gallica if I remember rightly.

Matthew

Regio is also a traditional system, as is Placidus and Alchabitius. Play with these. You might see less offsetting. I strictly do traditional but I don't use whole signs.

I find myself in the same situation. Like the OP I have lived long enough to review that quadrant systems work sometimes, but equal house solves my 3rd/5th house problem. (It is empty unless using EH which places saturn there. EH also moves mars to the fourth from fifth.)

I'm a neophyte to traditional astrology but I know Lilly says mars in fifth signifies bratty kids (sorry, forgot his word) which is far from the case with my 2 kids, who are extremely venusian. Saturn in third describes: interrupted education, writing on scientific topics, extreme difficulty writing, copy editing career, trouble through siblings, premature death of TWO siblings in one week. Saturn rules 7th-8th and I met both husbands in bookstores, which i believe are 3rd house? I can't fathom how all this could take place with an empty 3rd house. Granted, L3 is in bad shape, but the transits involved saturn, not L3.

When I first learned about (basic) astrology, in the early 1960's, the almost universally used chart system (in the English speaking world) was Placidus (with a small number of exponents of equal house, such as Charles Carter and many of his British School students) I had good results with Placidus but there was always a degree of confusion more or less present in some areas of analysis-and it never seemed right (to my simple mind) that such a thing as an "intercepted" sign could happen in the natural (or indeed the metaphysical) World. Back then (the 60's) Koch and Regiomantis were known (but were mostly followed by European astrologers, rarely by American astrologers) None of us had ever even heard of the Whole Sign House method. By the 1990's I had discovered the WSH method: for me it presented clear, never confusing indications; and (to my mind) it is both easy to understand and in accord with (my view) of Nature. I've been using WSH exclusively ever since for all branches of astrological analysis.

I did a little experiment here on Skyscript relative to the effects upon astrological analysis of using various house systems (you will find it around page 2 of the "Kepler Key" thread here in the Traditional/Ancient Techniques Section) As you will see if you check that posting, in a key element of my analysis of the Robert Boulin death controversy, the application of several different house methods (including equal, Porphyry and Koch) resulted in the same Part of Death and Death Indicator as I derived using the WSH method: however-and this struck me-when I applied Placidus and Regiomantus methods I obtained an entirely different Part of Death and Death Indicator, which were very "foreign" to (my perception) of the "pattern" of the chart, and which-if I had tried to apply them in analyzing the Boulin chart-would not have yielded significant, relevant indications.

One experiment proves nothing, but might give a hint.

As I stated above, however, for ME, personally, there is no question or contest: its Whole Sign House, superior for all applications.

(PERSONAL EXPERIENCE & OPINION ONLY, PLEASE!!)

I haven't found this discussed elsewhere, if so, please direct me.

After decades of using Koch houses for modern-style character interpretation, and dabbling, very lightly in Horary using Louis' 1990 book, I was recently drawn into studying traditional natal techniques.

[snip]

So now I'm stymied about how to proceed with the application of the ancient techniques as there's no point in trying to do predictions until I feel confident in the house system I am using.

How do you handle this?

Hope you don't mind my "snipping" some text. Some thirty odd years ago I was educated as a modern astrologer. With time I was drawn to a more traditional approach. I had the same problems as you regarding which house system to use. Like you I had been using Koch with satisfying results (natal and prediction). So I tried a few systems (mainly whole sign and alchabitius) for a while and now I am working with both alchabitius and whole sign.

I might come back to using Koch and whole sign one day and I'm confident it will not jeopardize my using in priority all the traditional tools and techniques I have learned so far.

Yes Rob Hand's lecture on Reception is very good material; I recently ordered his lecture on triplicities and found it quite interesting. Good luck in your quest

james