in every case according Andrea Argoli:

Regulus with the lord of the soul or the ruler of temperament gives generosity; with Arcturus honesty and ambition; with Spica cordiality; Cor Scorpii generous but rash;
Aldebaran fierceness and the same Hercules; the Triangle with Mercury the astute; Caput Serpentarii with the Moon the treacherous.

Rictus Capricorni with Mercury a shining mind; Pleiades incline to voluptuousness, Lyra to talent and music, Aquila the brave and unwon especially if culminates with Mars, Cingulus Orionis gives industry and a bright mind.

The stars of Jupiter and Mars generous and ambitious; the Jupiter's ones with Mars temerarious and hot heated.

Hope no mistake in my Latin, in the case forgive me.

margherita

Dear PFN,
Since your focus is on the fixed stars, I'd like to know whether when considering a nativity for a northern latitude, you consider only those fixed stars that have a northern declination or do you consider all, regardless of their declination north or south.

Also, is it true, as Simmonite says, that any fixed star whose declination is greater than the latitude of one?s place of birth will not affect the nativity because it cannot rise or set at that latitude?

It might be an interesting piece of information for your study perhaps that in a nativity which I was studying, the person had met with a terrible accident at the age of 25.5 years and almost none of the secondary or primary directions showed the violence except the exact conjunction of the progressed ascendant with Caput Algol at precisely that age.

Thanks in advance.
Ezra

The book of,
Richard Hinckley Allen:
Star Names ? Their Lore and Meaning
discusses the constellations and stars and and the myths about them it really is a good read and worth to buy the book. http://penelope.uchicago.edu/Thayer/E/G ... /home.html

Hello Ezra,

So far, I've been taking into consideration only stars that are actually able to rise in said hemisphere.

Hence, i.e, I do not look at Polaris for a sourthern nativity, neither look at Acrux for a northern one, as it would make little sense in my conception to look at Stars that can not be seen at a specific place. Also, I do respect the visibility of Stars, but, if the star is possible to be seen during a time, and not at another, it is an entirely different matter, since there is a cycle involved, and the analysis would have to be of a different kind.

Obviously, this is my current position, but it is open to change upon arguments practical or theorical that can be usefull and true.

Thanks Paulo.

margherita wrote:so obviously not all those who has Mars/Saturn has significator for the soul,

Just curious. What is the significator of the soul? Are you referring to the Almutem Figuris, the Lord of the Genitor or something else perhaps? I am very interested in the more "spiritual" aspects of traditional astrology. Thanks.

Hello,

The alchemist wrote: Just curious. What is the significator of the soul? Are you referring to the Almutem Figuris, the Lord of the Genitor or something else perhaps? I am very interested in the more "spiritual" aspects of traditional astrology. Thanks.

I meant Ptolemy's chapter which is called "on the qualities of the soul".
It should be a reference to Aristotle.

It is the almuten of Moon and Mercury, according the given rules.

margherita

I think that the alchemist is referring to something later than Ptolemy. Definitions differ but the Lord of the Geniture can be the most dignified planet and the native may behave like that planet.


I suspect that the more complex calculation of the Almuten Figuris says more about the spirit or soul and this could be something to consider if like the alchemist you are looking for the more "spiritual" side of traditional astrology.

I hope that this suggestion helps.

Matt

Hello Matt,

matt23z wrote:I think that the alchemist is referring to something later than Ptolemy. Definitions differ but the Lord of the Geniture can be the most dignified planet and the native may behave like that planet.

please consider that The Alchemist mentioned something I wrote, so that was what I had in mind.

Anyway in more general terms, I know there is the fashion to say that Ptolemy was just a compiler of no merit, but in my opinion - and I will be surely wrong- Medieval and Renaissance astrologers just re-elaborated Ptolemy thought.

Surely they even differ here and there but the pristine source is without any doubt Ptolemy.
I really I don't understand one can read a Medieval author or a Renaissance one, like Schoener, Giuntini, Cardano, Argoli, Lilly and so on without reading (and understanding) Ptolemy.

How many people for example commented Lilly table of temperaments? But how many mentioned that Lilly takes word by word from Ptolemy? Very few, because they never thought to open Tetrabiblos...

margherita

Thank you Margherita and Matt.

Basically, what I'm trying to find is the soul's mission for this incarnation in the chart and any indications for spiritual development. Of course, we could say that the entire chart is karmic, because the native's character, temperament, life circumstances, opportunities and challenges are what he has chosen to work on in this incarnation. But I suspect that there must also be planets indicating the path that one could follow to develop spiritually. I'm thinking for example that people who are involved with astrology and the Hermetic arts, would probably have a strong Mercurian influence, while those following a devotional path a Jupiterian one.

I am familiar with Jeff Green's work on Pluto and the Moon's nodes (as discussed somewhere on the forum) and even though he is not a traditional astrologer, I believe that his material is worth reading.

I am also familiar with the Almutem Figuris of medieval astrologers and the Lord of the Geniture as proposed by Lilly, but I suspect that these are two different things. I suspect that the Lord of the Geniture shows the general predisposition of the personality, while the Almutem Figuris the potential for accelerated spiritual growth. But this is just my own theory. The 9th house of course is also very important in this.

John Frawley has also written an article on the Architecture of the Soul. While I'm not sure I agree with all that he says, it is an interesting read (especially with regards to the Part of Fortune).

The problem with the Western astrological tradition is that most of the material is fragmentary and often conflicting. On the other hand, the level of detail that the astrology of the East (Vedic, Jyotish) places on the spiritual side of things and the different techniques that they use, is simply astounding!

I just wish we could unify the different theories and material extant in the West.

Margherita,

English translators use similar words to describe concepts but when you read the author's definitions they sometimes give different formulae. Some people may prefer one idea over another in their practice

I certainly did not mean to imply anything about the worth of Ptolemy and may I assure assure you that my own copy of Tetrabiblos has been opened more than once.

Matthew

Hi Margherita,

margherita wrote:Anyway in more general terms, I know there is the fashion to say that Ptolemy was just a compiler of no merit, but in my opinion - and I will be surely wrong- Medieval and Renaissance astrologers just re-elaborated Ptolemy thought.

Oh, that's not just an opinion, there's very little way to deny that Ptolemy is the bedrock of almost all Medieval and Renaissance astrology. Whether this was good is the matter for opinion.