25 by Mark Tom wrote: Mark If I send you the data privately, could you erect the chart and withhold it? Be happy to do that since others seem to want it. Yes. I followed Konrad's advice (thanks!) and have figured how to remove the identifying info from the chart pdf using paint features. Its more messy looking than the way you do it though! Thats cool as I have a few charts I could use for Mystery charts myself. Just to clarify is it Lahiri or Krishnamurti ayanamsa people want it displayed in ? Mark As thou conversest with the heavens, so instruct and inform thy minde according to the image of Divinity William Lilly
26 by Konrad Janis Valkovskis wrote:I have been skimming through the Book of the Nine Judges and found on page 176 if the lord of the east happened to be within 12 degrees of the Sun going to be scorched (which is not the case here, it is about to leave the rays) nor however received, it is fatal. In B.Dykes footnote we read that it is a nice reminder that the reception by the Sun (i.e., while he is in Leo or Aries) can save a planet from scorching. It is included in the section which deals with the 6th house matters. Janis, how do you know Mercury is coming out from the beams? We don't have his motion, so he may be slowing to a station. I was also in a rush when I last typed my post. When I said "fit for the job" I meant that he will try to do it but he will not be able to do much for the native, Mars will do more. Mercury also being under the beams is a case of "returning" so all this management and power being spoken of is going to be returned to the Moon. As for the rest, I don't want to butt heads about it. I disagree with your assertions and your sources. I would tend to follow the 15 degree limit of combustion and I don't see how reception (impossible in conjoining signs in the Tropical zodiac) will stop the Sun from burning a planet. I'll leave it there though. http://www.esmaraldaastrology.wordpress.com
27 by Janis Valkovskis It is obvious that Mercury is coming out of the rays. It is some 10 degrees distant (to the west) from the Sun. It retrogrades when it is some 20 degrees western from the Sun. See the figure 49"Generic synodic cycle of inferiors' on page 102 of the Introduction to Traditional Astrology translated by B.Dykes. Even if Mercury is considered not fit for business because it is under the rays with which I disagree and returns power (tropical) or management (sideral) whatever to the Moon, it returns it with fitness and usefulness and the Moon is strong enough to manage affairs as she pleases on her own. See figure 82 (page 178) of the ITA where you can find an example of returning with fitness and usefulness. If we apply the orb of 15 degrees to all planets, Mercury would be almost always unfit for any business and would return whatever is pushed to it, which I cannot accept. I suggest maximum some 7 degrees if it is applying scorching and not more than 5 if it is leaving. In practice, I use even smaller orbs.
28 by Mark Konrad wrote: I would tend to follow the 15 degree limit of combustion and I don't see how reception (impossible in conjoining signs in the Tropical zodiac) will stop the Sun from burning a planet. I'll leave it there though. The Sun and Mercury are not in the same sign tropically here. Leaving aside Janis's point about reception in hellenistic astrology a planet in one of its own 'chariots' (domicile, exaltation or bound) was believed to be protected from being burned up under the Suns beams. In the tropical chart Mercury is in Virgo so clearly in one of its chariots. Mark As thou conversest with the heavens, so instruct and inform thy minde according to the image of Divinity William Lilly
29 by Mark I dont know what house system Tom displayed the tropical chart with but I have used Alcabitius since it was the most popular house system in the medieval period. Here is the chart displayed in a sidereal format (Lahiri ayanamsa). If anyone is desperate to see the chart in another house system (any zodiac) give me a shout. Mark As thou conversest with the heavens, so instruct and inform thy minde according to the image of Divinity William Lilly
30 by Graham F Thanks Mark Tom must have used true nodes, as that would explain the different offset from tropical for the nodes as compared to the other planets. Graham
31 by Mark Hi Graham, I see you prefer Whole sign houses in Lahiri ayanamsa. Here you go: Mark As thou conversest with the heavens, so instruct and inform thy minde according to the image of Divinity William Lilly
33 by Konrad Janis Valkovskis wrote:It is obvious that Mercury is coming out of the rays. It is some 10 degrees distant (to the west) from the Sun. It retrogrades when it is some 20 degrees western from the Sun. See the figure 49"Generic synodic cycle of inferiors' on page 102 of the Introduction to Traditional Astrology translated by B.Dykes. Even if Mercury is considered not fit for business because it is under the rays with which I disagree and returns power (tropical) or management (sideral) whatever to the Moon, it returns it with fitness and usefulness and the Moon is strong enough to manage affairs as she pleases on her own. See figure 82 (page 178) of the ITA where you can find an example of returning with fitness and usefulness. If we apply the orb of 15 degrees to all planets, Mercury would be almost always unfit for any business and would return whatever is pushed to it, which I cannot accept. I suggest maximum some 7 degrees if it is applying scorching and not more than 5 if it is leaving. In practice, I use even smaller orbs. Yes, you're right. I had a bit of a brain-freeze there with my comments on Mercury's motion. As for the rest, I said I didn't want to butt heads over it. Mark, I'm aware of the concept you mention, I don't follow it. http://www.esmaraldaastrology.wordpress.com
34 by Graham F Thanks Mark, but here's no need to worry - any house system will do as whole signs are easy to see. I mentioned Lahiri because it's the best known, but I think more people on the forum use Krishnamurti. Again it's our job to be able to make the little adjustments if we feel it's important. Just by the way, the chart layout in SF I like best (as I wrote to Paul in another thread, and James agreed, and Paul as well I think) is the Equal house option - simply because it puts the ascendant in the normal place on the left, horizontal and makes the angles etc easier to read. Morinus does this automatically even when "Whole Sign" is selected. In SF I usually use Equal and Uni2a or Uniextra4 wheel styles. But it might be nice to use the wheel called "Zodboth" for the forum, as both tropical and sidereal are on one chart. Graham
35 by Tom I don't do sidereal. I have nothing against it, but I have enough going on without adding a zodiac. I have to point out something in this chart though comparing the two zodiacs. In the tropical, Mars is in Domicile opposite the MC which is in his detriment. Mars is very strong. In the sidereal, the MC is in Aries ruled by Mars posited in his detriment. Mars is very weak. Let's see how this plays out when we discuss who he is. By the way after about 40 seconds thought, I decided to give a tiny hint in order to keep people from getting off track through no fault of their own. Without alluding to his precise age, this native is still living. I only mention that so we are not looking for professions or trades that either no longer exist or eliminating from our thinking professions or trades that didn't exist way back when. This is not an historical figure who lived in some remote era.
36 by Konrad I wouldn't say Mars is weak, he is being received by a dignified and angular Jupiter (in his triplicity and bounds). He might produce ruined things eventually according to his rulerships (the 5th particuarly since the Sun is so well-positioned) but weak is a bit of an exaggeration. I'm not finding planets in detriment that big a deal if they are received anywa, nowhere near as bad as being in fall. http://www.esmaraldaastrology.wordpress.com