But what does he say at 1:00?

I have wished you joy since the first time I saw you.

I'm inclined to think that the aspect itself will show some kind of event, and the debility will show the effect or the nature of the outcome (perfection).

Exactly

The essential/accidental debility of the significator(s)/their position in each other's detriment or fall doesn't necessarily mean the desired event won't happen. However, it may symbolize its quality will be low and a relatively quick corruption of the matter will ensue.

Later I'll post one such chart from my own practice.

Goran

I asked a question where moon (though not main significator) in cancer was applying to saturn in scorpio. I'll come back and report should anything happen if it will help.

My question - is a romantic relationship with long term potential on its way?
Result - yes but unsatisfactory
Time frame - 2 months

7h in libra, venus in scorpio and the guy was a player. He already had a long term partner who he told me was an ex. I'm not sure if he was seeing anyone besides her.
The relationship hardly lasted for 3 months.

So i think the event can 'happen' but the end will be unsatisifactory.[/img]

I can not give example from my professional practice due to matter of confidentiality, however, from my personal collection, one friend has agreed that I could share her question asked to me.

This question was the first ever horary question I tackled and only basics I knew were from a instructions published by Deb on Skyscript.

Question: Will I marry him?

Time : 17:34 hours
Place : Rawalpindi (Pakistan)
Date: 07th of February 2007
Preferred house system: Regiomontanus
Ascendant: 17 degrees and 08 minutes of Leo


Answer: Yes
Outcome: Yes. They got married in 3 months.

Feed back: Both of them have a happy marriage with 2 kids and they have settled in a foreign country.

Sun in Aquarius applies to Saturn in Leo.

An interesting example may clearly represent the confirmation of the following in Book of Astonomy:

And may you know the detriment of
whatever planet [you are dealing with]: nor does any aspect suffice (unless
reception intervenes), that will break its malice.

A strong mutual reception is given in this case, though both planets are in their own detriments. I imagine it may not have turned out so well if both planets had been in each other's detriment/fall(or perhaps only one of them).

In other words, reception seems to be able to overrule the essential corruption of detriment/fall and bring matters to pass.

It is also worthy of note that both the querent's significator is in the house of the matter, and the ruler of the matter inquired about is in the first! Additionally, the Moon is applying to the Sun from the 3rd, coming from the house of its enemies i.e, fall - I wonder if it designates some negative "feminine" influence upon the querent - mother/older sister?

Seen from another perspective, the Moon is the natural ruler of change/travel, rules the 12th(again, long travel/foreign countries like generally all of the cadent houses) and is separating from Mars, (the ruler of the 9th and the natural ruler of travel) in the 6th! So every cadent house of this chart/natural and accidental rulers of travel are involved with the querent's significator, clearly symbolizing the potential for moving abroad. The same is signified by the POF in the 9th in Aries and its ruler Mars in the cardinal Capricorn in the 6th.

I wonder if she experienced this change as rather "negative"/burdensome because of the Moons application from Libra/via combusta?

All in all,this would also be consistent with Masha'allah's teaching - he gives an example of the Sun in Libra and Saturn in Aries receiving each other though both planets are in their own falls and opposition is involved on top of that!

For reception effects matters, so that it can no way happen but that it comes to be - whether it were delayed or is going to come about shortly, but the angles hasten the matter, and strengthen it, and the following domiciles or those succeeding [the angles] are useful; but the cadents(which do not aspect the ascendant?) delay the matter and postpone it. But reception cannot pass over into nothing, even if a period of time came in between, by the command of God.
Masha'allah, On Reception

Goran

My question - is a romantic relationship with long term potential on its way?
Result - yes but unsatisfactory
Time frame - 2 months

7h in libra, venus in scorpio and the guy was a player. He already had a long term partner who he told me was an ex. I'm not sure if he was seeing anyone besides her.
The relationship hardly lasted for 3 months.

So i think the event can 'happen' but the end will be unsatisifactory

A very nice example, thanks

What stands out for me is that both the Moon and the ruler of the ascendant, Mars are applying/being applied to by the ruler of the matter - it "had to" happen, so to speak

However, all the participants are also in the bad houses of the chart - the Moon in the 6th coming to Venus from the house of her enemies i.e. fall/vice versa and Mars/Venus in the 8th where Mars receives Venus.

Since all three are in aversion to the ascendant, I wonder if matters of secrecy/distance were involved in this relationship?

Goran

I had a chart that had a trine between significators but in each other's detriment. Unfortunately, the chart has been deleted since

The question was regarding some plumbing/unblocking of drains that I needed to be done, I had been battling with it myself with different products from supermarket, but was unsuccessful. Finally I called the landlord who in turn got me in touch with a plumber. So I asked will the plumber be able to fix the issue? I was signified by Saturn Rx and the plumber by Moon (6th house ruler), Moon was strong in Cancer in 6th house trine Saturn in Scorpio (me)... I was confused by the mutual negative reception, and retrograde Saturn.

What happened was the plumber came and fixed this issue, it was ok the first day but by next morning the water was again not going through the drains properly, even more severe blockage...I was upset because that meant I again had to call the plumber, and make sure I was home between the specific hours that he could come..He was apologetic, but I knew he had to travel quite a bit to get to my place, so he was also unhappy with the fact that he had to return to fix it again.

He did fix it, there was no blockage after the second time. But now a month later there is some smell coming from the drains. Nothing too serious, but I am definitely not calling him back. Will fix the issue myself.

So this was the outcome from Moon in Cancer trine Retrograde Saturn in Scoprio. I suppose Retrograde showed 'going back or return' as was the case with this -he had to return, or I had to revisit the issue again.

Here's one of the examples from my own practice - one of the first horaries I delineated

http://img594.imageshack.us/img594/1734/zle2.png

It was a typical 'love' question(no wonder the hour ruler was Mars, lord of the 7th), the querent wanted to know whether he'll get the chance to meet/have a relationship with the girl he saw working that day in an exchange office.

Based on the knowledge gained from this site and Frawley's The Horary Textbook (warm greetings/thanks to Deb&John!) I affirmed he probably would, within about three weeks (months were not an option!) because Venus catches up with Mars in three degrees.

However, I didn't like Mars's position in its own sign (too self-possessed/centered for a successful, stable relationship) and the Moon's position in the sign of its fall - exactly to the degree and in via combusta. The south node in the 1st was not a good omen either.

The result - they first met three weeks later and a week after that, the relationship was 'officially' established.

However, it was pretty short because the querent had to go back to a foreign country to finish his studies within a month and a half (note the Venus/Mercury separation in the eleventh, Mercury being the ruler of the 9th), and the quesited also became involved with someone else in the meantime.

From this perspective, I find it very telling that the relationship actually began on the very day the transiting Sun(the almuten of the descendant degree and the chart luminary) came into exact trine to Mars's position in the chart thus activating Venus by conjunction as well (Sahl ibn Bishr, On Times)

I also find it fascinating that on that day (14th August) Mars entered the antiscia point of Venus.

Mars as a natural contrary to sect malefic in a cardinal sign of Venus's detriment does (at least partly) explain all the trouble/anxiety/pressure he experienced within this short time span the relationship lasted.

Goran