?11 All the king?s servants, and all the provinces that are under his dominion, know, that whosoever, whether man or woman, cometh into the king?s inner court, who is not called for, is immediately to be put to death without any delay: except the king shall hold out the golden sceptre to him, in token of clemency, that so he may live. How then can I go in to the king, who for these thirty days now have not been called unto him??

?1 And on the third day Esther put on her royal apparel, and stood in the inner court of the king?s house, over against the king?s hall: now he sat upon his throne in the hall of the palace, over against the door of the house. 2 And when he saw Esther the queen standing, she pleased his eyes, and he held out toward her the golden sceptre, which he held in his hand and she drew near, and kissed the top of his sceptre. 3 And the king said to her: What wilt thou, queen Esther? what is thy request? if thou shouldst even ask one half of the kingdom, it shall be given to thee.?

Right now ? in general terms - astrological timing does not support a woman playing hard to get and expecting a chase (this agrees with your experience of the recent horary you mentioned). At other times, the cycle might show that it is in a woman?s interest to hold back a little, or that a man should expect to work hard if he wants to reconcile with a lover after a disagreement.

Kirk wrote:Deb wrote:

The trouble is, if we start applying it toward same-sex couples based on who is doing the attracting and who is the powerful masculine object of desire, then we need to be able to switch Sun and Venus for heterosexual couples too, depending on who is more actively or passively participating in the exchange. That starts to make a mess of tidy symbolism.

Homosexual relationships can be tricky but, at this point, i'd simply leave the natural significators of femininity and masculinity out of the picture- delineating natal charts of homosexual people and answering their questions about love life, marriage (i'll simply call it marriage here regardless of whether it can or will become official in terms of legal marriage), quality of relationships and communication with their own sex even the prospect of having children (and how) is tricky enough- well balanced aspects between natural significators do not work any more or, in better words, do not have the expected manifestation in private/love life, the Sun can always be a husband but will the traditional aphorisms work now that we don't have a very feminine planet on the other side to represent the wife (since we don't have a wife)....all, very, very tricky.


As for the last part of your post, Kirk, I have noticed that, in Horary relationship/marriage charts, mars/venus rulerships on 1st/7th axes often show up when the partners are "equal" in some way- equally interested in starting a relationship (similar average velocity could be a good reason - the people walk towards each other unlike i situations when a very slow planet, like Mercury, applies to Jupiter as, then we can assume that Mercury represents the more ardent and active of the two), mutual wish to stay married, relationship generally full of understanding etc. But, at the same time, I have seen surprisingly many charts were woman's Ascendant was placed in the rulership of Mars- very recently I found it in a chart cast for a question of a female Querent; her boyfriend had proposed to her 3 months prior to the question and after 7 years of relationship only the things soon started going downhill with no obvious reason. Long story short- she was a very liberal girl (young woman) and even a feminist but also a Roman catholic (though, not a practical believer) whilst her boyfriend was from a Jewish family and his parents were not really comfortable with her beliefs but didn't like the fact that she was a Catholic either- after 7 years of spending almost every single day with her, he was ashamed to admit that he comes from a family that hates feminists and was literally afraid to say that in front of her; their relationship became a mess only because he was afraid that he might actually lose her if she'd find out about his parents attitude. At the same time- she thought that he had cooled off. So, she got Mars as her ruler for a good reason.

Would anyone have any trouble using it a little more symbolically ? that this ?woman? could be a woman or man who is trying to draw toward herself or himself another woman or man?

I'd say that the whole chart should be taken into consideration in such cases as well as the nature of the question as well as of the situation- the Lord of the Quesited conjunct Venus could obviously be a good sign of the Querent's "man" having an affair with another woman but, of course, as long as it is possible in reality.

cosmicdolphin wrote:hey guys/gals

HAPPY NEW YEAR TO EVERYONE!

I wonder if you guys realize but Merc / Sun perfection happens first before venus/sun conjunction.

Here is what i read from Sylvia de Long... she says that if significators are SUn and another planet, combustion does not taken into consideration.

Cheers
T

23. Beware in all Judgments, when the Significator of the question is either Combust, or in Opposition to the Sun, he will then signify nothing of the matter, no good, nor is be able to bring anything to perfection.

35. In all Questions, know there?s not so great an affliction to the Moon, as when she is in Conjunction with the SUN; the ill aspects of the infortunes doth much afflict her, but none so powerful as her Combustion.

Again, it is my impression but I would take the fact that the Queret's ruler is combust very seriously and not as a good sign.

Yeah, of course but right now Mercury is approaching sun faster than venus. So i cant say that venus/sun conjunction applies for right now.

If a planet is strong by sign but combusted, it is just fear with no foundation.

cosmicdolphin wrote: Remembr that combusted planet is fearing something or someone is overwhelming the questioned or querent and he/she will not perform cause of that. If a planet is strong by sign but combusted, it is just fear with no foundation. if it is weak and combusted, planet work at all esp when it is in weak house.

Cheers everyone
CD

I joked about the Sun heating Venus up, but if Venus was a primary ruler, that would be a problem.

Tanit wrote:

Yeah, of course but right now Mercury is approaching sun faster than venus. So i cant say that venus/sun conjunction applies for right now.

I didn't have a horary in mind for right now, but someone else brought up Venus' superior conjunction on Jan 11th (Mercury is 13 degrees ahead of them both at this time). I also don't know how prohibitory inferior retro Mercury would be for Venus, since the Sun will combust another planet no matter how many other planets are around? Mercury as a primary significator would be troublesome in a love horary in this case.

If a planet is strong by sign but combusted, it is just fear with no foundation.

That's an interesting theory, and might relate to the email question I have posted in another thread.

Behold if Venus be Occidentall, Retrograde and hastening to Combustion, then of her owne accord the woman will returne to her Husband, fearing by her absence she shall offend him, and she is sorry she ever departed from him; but if she be lately separated from the Sun beames, then it repents the man that he gave occasion to his Wife to absent her selfe, or that he abused her; but the woman will be angry and malapert, and seems sorry that she shall returne, nor will she much respect her Husband after that time.