Becca wrote:

AstroNovice wrote: I am making the claim that solar returns should not be relocated.

I find making the claim that a solar return should not be relocated is akin to saying to someone, "You should not relocate", when one reason why we relocate is to alter our experience of the natal 'promise' and a relocated chart reflects the alteration.

james_m wrote:astronovice,

here are some more thoughts to go with the conversation..


i like the fact you pointed out the solar return chart is essentially a transit chart with one important distinction - it focuses greatly on the sun's position, thus solar return.. i think the outer planets in a solar return chart - one can include jupiter/saturn and etc - will be ongoing transits for the year - especially saturn and the planets further out.. if a planet like mars this year - does a station - it will impact the chart in all likelihood if it is in wide orb to the lights and etc as well.. - so yes - that is how i see it too.. solar return is transit data with the large exception that it is a focus on the sun.. we could ask just how important the sun is in astrology and whether we don't give it more weight then it really deserves too.. i would say that in a solar return the sun is given it's rightful place as the most central consideration with regard to all the bodies in the solar system astrologers opt to consider..

the angles are obviously quite important too! they will change in a relocated sr, but as you also point out - we still need to keep a focus on the natal chart with it's unique angles being the most individualistic points to any chart - at the top of our focus as well..

the problem with using a well known person such as obama who we have a AA rating from according to adb - http://www.astro.com/astro-databank/Obama,_Barack
has to do with who knows just where he was on his last birthday? we can guess it was in washington dc, or camp david where he may have spent it?

as a consequence trying to work out relocated charts is best done in your own person if you live and experience solar returns at a different location then your birth location.. trying to do it with famous people presents the problem of how do you know that is where they were on their solar return? this is another reason why i like working with natal solar return charts.. i do like looking at events with people for the location though and often it is different then their birth location. this is the way i do relocational astrology.. doing it with solar returns seems more tricky unless you know for a fact obama was somewhere on his sr..

i know there is some guy claiming that he can set you up with the most favourable solar return by telling you were to relocate to for your birthday! this seems to be an offshoot of astrocartography which essentially says that by relocating to a different place you can strengthen a particular planet - by putting it on the angle for example - which will somehow be of greater benefit - if you are not happy with your life at your present location!!!! well, hopefully you can see the potential for $$$$ in this idea.. i think people move places based on circumstances often outside their control.. maybe some people have a choice about where they might go - a holiday - or more permanent - work, but this sounds more unusual even today..

Becca wrote:AstroNovice

Okay.

So basically, what I'm trying to say is that if one probable circumstance is not accessible to a placement, it will find an alternative outlet.

Imagine a man who, for years, works as a web developer in London. He relocates to live in Ireland with no opportunities to continue in this field but with an 11thH Mercury placement still imprinted on the chart, although shifted into the 12thH using, say, the Placidus house system, is left to be channeled through a suitable outlet. An alternative might be no longer writing HTML codes for a software company but he instead writes movie scripts for a theather company. Mercury remains intact but unravels in a different house, through a different-ish circumstance.

I don't know, is this the sort of answer you were hoping for to get clarity?


I am not as comfortable with natal astrology and I am struggling to communicate with and express this to you. Its very frustrating. This is why I edited and deleted my other post so many times, sorry.

Donna Chang wrote:Hi Astro Novice,

Your thoughtful post was timely as I recently relocated myself on my birthday, for the second time in my life.

I agree with your view that solar returns have a cyclical quality. But I don't see that there is any logic to it, in the true sense of the word. Logic says that the truth of something lies in the premises--there is no need to gather empirical evidence. Astrology is not a logical study, like mathematics. We look for the truth in astrology in experience--to the world. We look for rationality there. While the cyclical nature of solar returns looks rational, that doesn't mean it can't be altered.

I never could see the harm in taking a birthday holiday to get a solar return stellium out of the 12th house, and I wonder that more people with the means to do it don't give it a try, instead of scolding people who do for being a nutter, as if studying astrology doesn't make you a nutter in the world's eyes as it is. Not that YOU scolded, far from it, and thanks for bringing up the subject in such a respectful way.

lifestudent wrote:Relocation SR charts will only affect you as long as you stay in that relocation. If you just go there for a few weeks around your birthday, then your SR chart back home will affect you as soon as you are back home.

It is the angles we need to look at. I've never looked at it in the house sense of way, but rather looked into which planets become angular to relocated angles within the mundoscope (real placement of planets at the location measured).