For the recent rowhouse fire in Philadelphia on Wednesday (Jan 5, 2022), where at least 12 people have died (8 children).

It's of course the Sagittarius ingress...

Fagan-Bradley: Uranus right on Asc, plus Pluto-Venus

Krishnamurti: Uranus, Moon, Saturn, and Mars

Both seem indicative, but since it relates to a FIRE, Krishnamurti gets the edge, since Mars (as expected) is angular at that location at the time. Since it could be argued both are correct, I reluctantly (I'm reluctant due to the missing Mars) give FB also a point. (ie. it's not COUNTER-INDICATIVE and Uranus-Pluto-Venus hints at an explosive event, where people have to say goodbye to loved ones.) I'm being as fair as I can!

Monthly Ingress
Scorekeeper: FB: 1; Kr: 3

For the Newark Explosion of an oil tank farm. (Jan 7, 1983)

Sagittarius Ingress

Fagan-Bradley: Pluto, Saturn

Krishnamurti: Uranus, Jupiter, Pluto, and Mars

Explosion with fire is more Uranus-Mars than Saturn-Pluto, so I have to give this one to Krishnamurti... (though the FB is not counter-indicative)

Monthy Ingress
Scorekeeper: FB: 1, Kr: 4

Port of Beirut explosion. (Aug 4, 2020)

Cancer Ingress

Fagan-Bradley: Saturn, Sun

Krishnamurti: Mars, Saturn, Pluto, Jupiter, Sun

Since it is known that a warehouse fire initiated the (later) explosion, I want to see Mars involved. Therefore, even though Saturn-Sun could be argued for property damage and government involvement; I have to give this one hands-down to Krishnamurti. Additionally, having Jupiter-Pluto seems right for the MAGNITUDE, since this explosion was felt throughout that country (Lebanon) as well as in neighboring countries.

Monthly Ingress
Scorekeeper: FB: 1, Kr: 5

Atlantean, thanks for keeping up the tempo here with additional events!

It's after midnight here in California, and I'm going to sleep. But you will also find sometimes dramatic and precise links between the Kr monthly ingress charts and event charts. Certain planets, and even the angles click into place in relation to the ingress chart. I know I saw these linking patterns in earthquake charts, and I assume they would also be in other types of event charts.

As I recall, these links often involved trine relationships, but degrees had to be partile or nearly so. As I recall, I'm talking about mainly partile relationships in all cases. It's been many years since I worked on this research, so I can't recall specifics.

Hungerford Massacre. (Aug 19, 1987)

Leo Ingress

Fagan-Bradley: Neptune (on Dsc), Uranus

Krishnamurti: Mars, Uranus, Saturn, Neptune, Sun, Venus

Neptune-Uranus (seen in both Ingresses) fits the "death" theme perfectly.

Adding Mars and Uranus seems better, since it fits thematically to a schizophrenic with a gun, suddenly laying waste to everything, including his Mother and his dog.

Monthly Ingress
Scorekeeper: FB: 1, Kr: 6

El Paso Walmart Shooting (Aug 3, 2019)

Cancer Ingress

Fagan-Bradley: nothing angular

Krishnamurti: Mars, Uranus



Monthly Ingress
Scorekeeper: FB: 1, Kr: 7

McDonald's Shooting in San Ysidro. (Jul 18, 1984)

Cancer Ingress

Fagan-Bradley: Mars

Krishnamurti: Mars, Saturn, Mercury

Since we're trying to distinguish between the two ayanamsas, it makes sense to see (in each case) which one better expresses the event. Mars shows the violence (and firearm), but Mars with Saturn better shows the extensive deaths.

Monthly Ingress
Scorekeeper: FB: 1, Kr: 8

Marjory Stoneman Douglas shooting (Feb 14, 2018)

Aquarius Ingress

Fagan-Bradley: Mars, Venus, Neptune (no Moon-Pluto conjunction)

Krishnamurti: Saturn, Neptune, and a Moon-Pluto conjunction (0° 11')

Too close to call. One point each. (though I'd say Krishnamurti, if I had to pick, because that Moon-Pluto conjunction seems "telling") ie. like it's supposed to be there

Monthly Ingress
Scorekeeper: FB: 2, Kr: 9

Edmond Post Office shooting (Aug 20, 1986)

Leo Ingress

Fagan-Bradley: Sun exactly on MC (no Moon-Mars conjunction)

Krishnamurti: Pluto, Sun, and a tight Moon-Mars conjunction (~1°)

Sun on the Midheaven would fit more or less for the fact it happened on U.S. Gov't property and that the government must react, but doesn't show what happened. Sun at the Midheaven, alone, would look more like celebration or positive achievement. Pluto with the Sun is a different story. When we see the Moon-Mars conjunction and factor in that people were shot and that it happened during working hours (also Moon-Mars), the FB chart seems quite wrong and the Krishnamurti chart seems very right.

Monthly Ingress
Scorekeeper: FB: 2, Kr: 10

Atlantean wrote:

Sun on the Midheaven would fit more or less for the fact it happened on U.S. Gov't property and that the government must react, but doesn't show what happened. Sun at the Midheaven, alone, would look more like celebration or positive achievement. Pluto with the Sun is a different story. When we see the Moon-Mars conjunction and factor in that people were shot and that it happened during working hours (also Moon-Mars). The FB chart seems quite wrong and the Krishnamurti chart seems very right.

Atlantean, I'm glad that you are noticing the Moon in these charts as well as the angles. We have a rather incomplete and hazy picture as far as the actual historical details that supposedly prove the Fagan-Bradley value, but with both Lahiri and Krishnamurti we have modern research that can be exactly tracked.

The Lahiri value was set by the Indian government after extensive historical research across a number of cultures. Krishnamurti adjusted this value by approximately six minutes based on precise work mainly with the ascendant based on current events timed to the moments that he predicted ahead of time. These are recorded in his books which however are badly written due to the poor English. His sons are continuing his legacy, and there is now a full blown Krishnamurti system of astrology alive and well in India and other places.

Astrologers who use the Krishnamurti ayanamsa are continually testing this value. There are Krishnamurti web sites and discussion forums, at least one on-line magazine in English and perhaps others in India. The Krishnamurti system relies on small sub-divisions of signs/lunar mansions which Krishnamurti claims to have discovered with (this is India!!) divine inspiration. I can post one of his examples if anyone is interested.

So we are now seeing some support for both the monthly solar ingress and the Krishnamurti ayanamsa. This has been a long time coming, and thanks to Atlantean we are finally tracking some events! (But eventually we'll be needing the full technical details of these charts and events.)

I'm mainly watching this conversation from the sidelines as it concerns modern techniques I don't use, but it may be worth mentioning that the late Rick Houck (also on the basis of modern techniques, and including transsaturnian planets) independently adjusted the Lahiri ayan??ṃśa by 6 minutes, before he ever heard of Krishnamurti. The difference between Houck's value and the Krishnamurti ayan??ṃśa is in the seconds of arc.

Yes, thanks for this reminder, Martin. Rick Houck used extremely precise techniques in his work. He's most famous for The Astrology of Death (Grundswell Press, 1994). His ayanamsa tables are on pages 40-41 of that book.

San Bernardino terrorist attack (Dec 2, 2015)

Scorpio Ingress

Fagan-Bradley: Jupiter, Saturn

Krishnamurti: Mars, Venus

As this was ultimately a shooting, and at the end a fatal shootout, by a married couple and the weapons were highlighted, due to extra charges being levied against those who lent material support by providing the weapons; Mars for the violence and firearms, (Mars-Venus, possibly for the couple) to me, seems a better fit.

Monthly Ingress
Scorekeeper: FB: 2, Kr: 11