Skyscript Astrology Forum

Ancient manuscripts were transcribed and re-transcribed and the appearance of newer terms in them can be ruled out on that base.

According to David Pingree, whose authority I am not (and never be) ready to contest, Sphujidhaja's Yavanajataka is from 3rd century, and is the versification of an earlier Sanskrit translation (from 2nd century).

You know very well no one can produce at this date an ancient Greek text the kind you mentioned. It is evident decenia is a latin word. We can only make the assumption that it represents the translation of a corespondent greek term (unless the ancient astrology is latin not greek, which is not the case).

Anyway, thank you for the time to enlighten persons like me, with less chance or time to devote themselves to a deep scientifical study of such a kind of, although unscientifical, interesting enough, if not provocative, ancient practices.

Radu Canahai wrote:Ancient manuscripts were transcribed and re-transcribed and the appearance of newer terms in them can be ruled out on that base.

Are you suggesting that the word daś?? 'state, condition' in the R??m??yaṇa was put there after the introduction of horoscopy in India, replacing some other, earlier term? That is, of course, an unfalsifiable claim (which in itself is a reason for treating it with suspicion), but it doesn't really fit in with how the word is used there. Take, for instance, a phrase like:

t??ṃ c??haṃ t??dṛśīṃ dṛṣṭv?? sīt??y?? d??ruṇ??ṃ daś??m
'And I, seeing Sīt?? in such harsh conditions ...' (or, to be more literal, 'seeing such a harsh condition of Sīt??'s' ...)

The meaning 'period' would make no sense here. Periods of life like childhood, youth, old age, etc., can be said to be conditions, but condition is the broader sense, of which 'period of life' is a secondary, specialized meaning. Being under the influence of a particular planet would be another example of a condition lasting for a certain time and therefore constituting a period. But using a word which originally meant 'planetary period of ten years' to denote 'condition of life in general' makes no sense.

According to David Pingree, whose authority I am not (and never be) ready to contest, Sphujidhaja's Yavanajataka is from 3rd century, and is the versification of an earlier Sanskrit translation (from 2nd century).

Oh, that is a very dangerous attitude in scholarship. Pingree was a trail-blazer, but his work is full of errors, and the dating of Sphujidhvaja is one such. I recommend these two papers by Bill Mak:

http://www.billmak.com/wp-content/uploa ... dhvaja.pdf

http://www.billmak.com/wp-content/uploa ... k-2014.pdf

I myself have made a number of corrections to Pingree's published work. On occasion, I have also corrected mistakes in my own previously published work, and others may find still more to correct in future.

You know very well no one can produce at this date an ancient Greek text the kind you mentioned. It is evident decenia is a latin word. We can only make the assumption that it represents the translation of a corespondent greek term (unless the ancient astrology is latin not greek, which is not the case).

We do have Greek texts (including Valens) which discuss the technique. I don't know if any of them use a name for it that includes the word deka (I haven't checked), but we can't just assume that such a name was used, and then assume that it was transmitted to India, and then assume that it gave rise to a calque, and then assume that the calque was introduced into manuscripts of pre-existing Sanskrit texts. There has to be some sort of reason for this chain of assumptions, beyond the near-homonymy of daśa and daś??.

I don't mean to sound too harsh; I'm sorry if I have offended you or anyone. But in both astrology and scholarship, I believe we need to be very careful and attentive to detail.

Thank you for the recommended references.
I'm sure not offended. The reason behind the lack of wish to contest Pingree's authority resides purely in my own condition: I'm not a scholar.

So Radu Canahai has become 'Das Greenhorn'!! We can all enjoy a little humor! We are smiling with you, Radu.

One term that quite obviously has its origin in Greek is hor?? (होरा), denoting a half-sign of 15 degrees.

While I have not been able to identify an exact equivalent to Indian astrology's hor?? in a Greek text so far, a related concept would be Valen's "steps."

If any reader has additional information, their input would be appreciated.