Yukionna wrote:

It's an interesting chart Mark, because not only does Mars overcome the Sun and planets in the 2nd house, but it also pushes its nature onto Venus. (Mars is faster in this case, Venus probably shortly before stationary).

Well noticed. An excellent point!

Oh dear, I only just now see that it also overcomes a planet, Venus. So we have a Venus that takes on Mars' nature from pushing, and Saturn's nature from overcoming, the poor thing.

Perfect!

The notes you made make me fairly confident that the guy must be notorious for his martial things, most probably a serial killer.

I do not associate these traits with the Moon, rather I would ascribe those traits to the prominent Venus on the Asc. Venus does like ease and sees how the world can be, rather than the harshness that it is. She would rather have a beautiful world, a life of ease, love, happiness, without troubles and worries, and yes a dreamer! That is her natural state, it?s a wonderful thing if only it could be that way! (I also have Venus on Asc in Libra). So I very much feel that way! Very prominent trait with Venus in Asc and 1st hse angle.

Well we are entitled to our opinions, and I'm sticking with mine. A Phlegmatic temperament combined with the Moon influencing the ASC will show a lack of motivation and ambition and hatred of hard-work, especially house-work, as my girlfriend will attest to! I'm not denying Venus' influence, but I am using a principle here I have seen in other charts involving different planets, so I will go with it until I see otherwise.

Have you given any thought that this behavior is due to Venus in Scorpio? What you describe above is not a Martian trait, as you say above you have not explosive temper in general life, if it were Mars it would show up with everyone, not just your girlfriends. Your description of SHARP and to the point is definitely that sting of Venus being in Scorpio to your GIRLFRIENDS. It is a Venus in Scorpio effect, and very prominently so, in the Asc and 1st hse angle. Your statement of it shows up in RELATIONSHIPS with girlfriends is very obviously to me that is the prominent VENUS, who rules relationships, Venus in Scorpio qualities. I?ll bet you also have love/hate relationships or feel that way sometimes regarding females you love.

No, I am sharp and to the point with everyone, explosive only with my girlfriend. I believe this is so due to my current understanding of the dignities and what they mean. I see the exalted lord as very important but it gives a different sort of information than the domicile lord does. I don't think this is the time to go too deeply into it, but it should suffice to say that the Moon being exalted lord of the 7th while being dominated by Mars shows an explosive reaction in certain situations involving her and me. Most of the day-to-day stuff is run by Venus and is completely fine, as you would expect of Venus without the regard of the malefics to be. No, I have no love/hate with any females, in fact I love them all, maybe a little too much!

That?s my two cents!

And thank you for it.

Mark, what is it exactly you are looking for with the mystery chart?

Hi Konrad,

Everyone has what works for them, and either method is good. I rather believe Morin, Zoller and Dykes in that a planet in a sign/house has more influence than the house ruler.

Thanks for bringing up an example of overcoming. Quite interesting, I am always learning something.
All the Best,
Morning Sun

Good morning,

I looked at the Pars Spiritus, because that shows us what is most important to the native, what he worships, and I found it quite telling that it's right on the AC. So it's all about him really. Like MorningSun said, rather egocentric this person.
Mars and Venus, the Triplicityrulers of the part regard it by sextile, so they add their signification to this, and a notable effect should be seen. This person worships himself, and does so in the dynamic way of the cardinal sign, and the devotional way of the water element. It gets better and better.

Janis, tnx for your praise, it's very encouraging..

msg deleted

hi marius,

i have read all this before and believe i understand the quotes, but it doesn't make the comments in your first post on this thread any more clear.. i think there is some sort of language barrier.. thanks for trying to clarify your position here regardless. cheers james

Yukionna wrote:

I looked at the Pars Spiritus, because that shows us what is most important to the native, what he worships, and I found it quite telling that it's right on the AC. So it's all about him really. Like MorningSun said, rather egocentric this person.

I am sure you are aware of this but for the benefit of other members I just thought I would recap that since the lot of Fortune and Spirit are calculated from the position of the luminaries and projected from the Ascendant they always appear in the same positions according to the lunation cycle.

New Moon= both lots on Ascendant
Full Moon= both lots in the 7th house
Quarter Moons= lots opposite each other

Hence in all exact new moon charts like this the lot of fortune, spirit and basis are generally in the 1st house. I am not sure I would accept that everyone with a new Moon chart is 'egoistic'.

One really difficult dimension of this chart is that weakened status of the moon combust the Sun. Here the Moon is sect light, ASC ruler and ruler of the lots of Fortune, Spirit and Basis. It wouldn't have been so difficult with another sign rising.

I should also point out that this date was not just the the time of a new Moon but also an eclipse. Although, it was was below the earth and not visible in the northern hemisphere many astrologers would still consider that significant.

I think I need to clarify this person was not a serial killer. Otherwise many of the comments here were spot on. I hope I didn't mislead people as I made a comment in another thread opened by Zoomaster just before inserting these charts where I commented that I had a chart for a French serial killer that was very difficult. It turns out my memory failed me and this person was not a killer at all. Apologies if I misled anyone.

I will be revealing the identity of this person soon.

Mark

mark,

thanks for pointing this out for others who may be unaware of this.. it is one reason i have great difficulty with this concept of the pof, or pos being in an angle as suggestive of a more prominent chart.. it means everyone born on the new or full moon qualifies..and those on the first and last quarter qualify too if born closer to the equator.. that doesn't make sense to me so i question this idea from the start.
the way i see it we are all blind touching the side of some large animal and describing it to the best of our abilities. this is how i see astrologers functioning. i am reminded of that saying 'a thief only sees a persons pockets'. one of us will see one thing, while another person will see something else. we are all blind for the most part is how i see it.

i look forward to talking about your chart more mark.. i think your mention of the serial killer really influenced my own and others views here, in spite of the unintentional nature of your earlier comments. what i find interesting on this chart is there are 2 examples of overcoming, but the one with the malefic out of sect strikes me as more of the problem then the other one.. however, that is just how i see it and we can talk about it more later.

James_M

thanks for pointing this out for others who may be unaware of this.. it is one reason i have great difficulty with this concept of the pof, or pos being in an angle as suggestive of a more prominent chart.. it means everyone born on the new or full moon qualifies..and those on the first and last quarter qualify too if born closer to the equator.. that doesn't make sense to me so i question this idea from the start.

I dont think the lots were used as a stand alone eminence indicator by astrologers like Valens. His primary consideration was the state of the triplicity rulers of the sect light. The lots were additional criteria which could add or diminish eminence indicators.

Of course the chart derived from the lots could be important too but in a new Moon chart the places are the same as in the normal zodiacal chart. This could be very strong if the ASC ruler was highly dignified in an angular house and especially the 10th.

Mark

James_M wrote:

.. i think your mention of the serial killer really influenced my own and others views here, in spite of the unintentional nature of your earlier comments.

Sorry about that.

As you state it wasn't intentional on my part. Nevertheless, I can understand how my recent comment on a different thread might well have influenced people's thinking here.

Despite that many of the comments here were very accurate.

Mark

Mark, tnx for pointing this out, I'm afraid I have to admit that I wasn't aware of it, although of course it's completely obvious. Maybe one shouldn't say that new Moon people are egoistic, it may just be that the focus is more on the self and the body, and less on others.
In this particular chart it just adds to all the other information, and as such might describe someone totally full of himself at the cost of others. But only in this particular instance.
In another chart it may just show that body and health, or appearance are overly important to someone. I wonder if this is so. Must keep an eye on that....

thanks mark,

i haven't viewed anything in astrology as a 'stand alone' tool or technique for defining a chart, but i thank you for these comments. of the 4 different approaches to triplicity rulers, which one do you like the best? i have mostly focused on dorotheus triplicity rulers which would put jupiter as the triplicity ruler for chart x here. what does your knowledge of the triplicity ruler conjunct the sect light tell you? morin would have mars as the triplicity ruler here.

Mark wrote:J

I dont think the lots were used as a stand alone eminence indicator by astrologers like Valens. His primary consideration was the state of the triplicity rulers of the sect light. The lots were additional criteria which could add or diminish eminence indicators.

Of course the chart derived from the lots could be important too but in a new Moon chart the places are the same as in the normal zodiacal chart. This could be very strong if the ASC ruler was highly dignified in an angular house and especially the 10th.

Mark