Zoomaster wrote:

Mark, I'd like to inquire as to when you intend to post the results.

For a more dramatic effect I think I will unveil the people on separate nights. Chart A on Monday night and chart B on Tuesday night. I am in the United Kingdom so I mean GMT

Mark

Mark wrote:Graham F

... I'll just post another one!

Could you drop me a PM on that first to let me know what you have in mind? We already have the charts in 4 house systems tropically and 2 sidereal! I am a bit concerned we will get so caught up in the technicalties of different house systems we will end up diminishing the key focus here which is delineation around these nativities occupation and primary motivation.

Thanks

Mark

Sorry Mark, the Topocentric was apparently added because people were getting "confused by the many house systems", I was trying to be ironical.
Graham

Graham F

Sorry Mark, the Topocentric was apparently added because people were getting "confused by the many house systems", I was trying to be ironical. Graham

Ok fine. Yes humour can get a bit lost on forums like this at times.

To avoid any further controversy I think I will avoid further comment before unveiling the chart identities.

Mark

Chart B

This chart looks difficult to delineate. Let me make an attempt.

This is well connected chart, libra stellium with saturn in exaltation, which is disposed by Venus in Scorpio, which is disposed by Mars in Leo, which is disposed by Sun in Libra.

Libra Stellium
The Libra stellium in the 9th of religion and 10th whole sign with Moon in Aquarius applying to them would indicate humanitarinaian concerns, equality for human being, equal rights for all and advocacy for common people.

Moon trine Saturn
Moon in Aquarius applies to a trine of Saturn which receives it. Saturn is in its exaltation. Moon-Saturn combination are difficult and leads to misery,hardships. Also trouble for the mother. But the trine and reception should be of help.

The Moon separates from Mercury/Scorpio before applying to Saturn. Based on Maternus, I wonder if this causes speech problems. Or does it indicates accounting/ business/writing skills or interest in occult (Mercury rules 9th)??

Interestingly the Nodes falling in the 1st/7th houses are disposed by Saturn and Moon. This would indicate the me-vs-you (1st vs 7th) are brought together with ease and may indicate a long-term relationship. Or does it indicate open invitation to enemies??

The Moon in Aquarius is in the 10th from POF, this could indicate working with public for humanitarian case.

Venus/Scorpio
All attention is drawn to Venus in the chart. It is very closely conjunct MC. No other planet is more angular than her. Venus disposes the Libra stellium. Venus rules POF and it is the ASC and Moon's bound ruler. Venus is in it's I think maximum elongation and is a evening star.

Venus/Scorpio (in detriment and in its triplicity) in the bound of Saturn. This may indicate it is in deep distress, fear and paranoia. Conjunct the MC this is all brought out to the world.

I am not sure how the maximum elongation of Venus and the detriment combination need to be intepreted.
One possiblity would be a person who is pushed into horrible fate of the nature of Scorpio (sex,poison,etc) or some great scandal and this is all brought out to the world.
Another possibility would be artistic outlet (Venus rules 5th) which is not mainstream. Uranus conjunct MC adds in unexpectedness, surprises and unusualness.

This might happen at early age during Venus firdaria (age 10-17)

Venus being at the very end of Scorpio, it will move into Sagittarius in the bound of Jupiter. I wonder if this will make Venus to breathe little easier later in life.

Retrograde Mercury in the same sign as Venus may indicate the native writes/talks about this experience later in life.

Mercury in Scorpio disposed by Mars in Leo would indicate communications based on secrecy/revenge/lies/threats/jealousy for fighting honour.

Mars in Leo: Mars disposes Venus and MC. It is in excellent solar phase. It wants to fight for honour.

Summary: Somebody who is motivated towards humanitarian cause, equality, championing for common people and fighting for honour. This will based on a fateful experience in life or an unusual/unique artistic expression.

I wonder with Moon in Aquarius separating from Mercury(ruler of 9th sign) applying to Saturn (conjunct 9th quadrant cusp), she is interested in astrology/occult?

There is also lot of knowledge/information/communication edge to the chart due to emphasis of the air signs libra and aquarius.

Chart A looks like writer to me,possibly of violent or gruesome stuff.
ASC ruler in pisces in 7 conjunct Mars

Some more thoughts on Chart B:

The Libra stellium in 9th quadrant and 10th sign involves the Sun, Saturn and Jupiter. All three are masculine planets in a masculine sign and with the moon applying to it, it could indicate help from (or importance of) male figures in her career and in her faith/religion.

Now combustion:
In the stellium, the ruler of the Chart Saturn in its exaltation is combust and so is Jupiter. Intrestingly the Moon is meeting Saturn who is just coming out of the conjunction, how would that manifest? The reception and trine definetly should help the Moon, but Saturn just coming out of conjunction might behave nasty ??? If the Moon denotes the mother in her life, the condition of her mother will help to understand this combination.

Now usually Sun conjunct Saturn would indicate difficulties for the father/husband. This is made worse with Sun in its detriment. The Sun separating from Saturn and applying to Jupiter in its own bound might be a blessing for the Sun; but Jupiter rules 12th sign - this could indicate further problem.
So the Sun is in a poor condition: (In its detriment, Cadent from the angles, conjunct Saturn, Rules 8th and applies to 12th sign ruler)
Other thing is in Capricorn ascendant, Saturn (which is conjunct Sun) automatically rules 2nd which is 8th from 7th indicating death of partner. Now the Sun rules 8th and Mars is in 8th. Sun applies to Jupiter which rules 3rd (Pisces) which is 8th from 8th (Leo). I may be getting carried away, but things doesn't look good for the Sun or the male figure in her life - father, partners, etc. The nature of Jupiter the greater benefic might be the only saving grace. But even Jupiter is combust!

Chart B:

Also the Moon (ruler of 7th) applying to Saturn the greater malefic and Saturn ruling the 2nd which is 8th from 7th indicates the same thing - death of partners

So if death of partners is indicated and if Venus in Scorpio indicates poison, does she kill them with poison?

Ok time to unveil our first Mystery chart.

Our individual is Tommy Sheridan, a Scottish socialist politician. Probably a total unknown outside Scotland Sheridan is actually one of the best known politicians in Scotland. Originally for his forceful and articulate demeanour as the leader of the Scottish Socialist party but more recently for his prominent court cases and imprisonment for perjury.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tommy_Sheridan

born 7th March 1964, Glasgow, Scotland, United Kingdom. 17.20 GMT

Note: In case your wondering Sheridan is a staunch atheist. Although his wife is a practicing Roman Catholic. While Sheridan is not the leader of a religious sect as some suggested Sheridan was for a while the charismatic leader of the Marxist democratic left in Scotland. During Sheridan's court cases a civil war erupted in the Scottish Socialist Party and its fortunes have subsequently waned. They have never been re-elected back into the Scottish parliament under their new leadership.

Morning Sun's earlier comment about Sheridan's Mother was very insightful. She was a Trade Unionist and campaigner to support women suffering domestic violence. Sheridan credits her as his main influence in getting him into political activism.

Despite the scandal Sheridan still has a lot of support in his home city of Glasgow amongst working class voters. He narrowly missed being elected as a councillor in the recent local government elections in Glasgow.

For all his undeniable failings I do think Sheridan is genuine in his commitment to a more egalitarian society where wealth is shared more fairly. This seems to be almost a secular faith for Sheridan. I think a few of you picked this up in his chart along with the potential for criminality.

I will leave some time for people to take a look at this before revealing the next chart.

Mark

Thanks for posting the link Mark! For someone not familiar with Scottish politics, it took some following. But good to know everyone got the general gist of this persons life!!

So for Chart B

There is another interpretation that I can see in the chart B. With a different house system. So I will give that here, since we do not know who this is yet.

I agree with some of the comments indicating a strong sexual theme, particularly with the Pluto added sextiling Mars. However, in my opinion, it was of a cruel type.

The Strong Saturn indicators for this woman, would have been very resticting for her, and Saturn ruling the 12th, could indicatate, she was held, kidnapped, imprisoned. The strong Sun/Saturn conjunction in the 8th, and Venus in Detriment in the 10th, ruled by Mars in the seventh, sextiling Pluto, could indicate cruel sexual abuse, rape, where she was held against her will. If she lived, I would say this experience, shaped her life, and would have been well publicized due to the Moon in the first trining Saturn, and Venus in the 10th. So she could have used this experience to be an advocate for abused or domestic violence advocate.

Or could she be the madam that imposed the cruelty and abuse? We will see!

Generally when we have a client, we get a sense, (I think much subconscious) regarding the person, their energy, the words they choose when they inquire to have their chart done, they voice their concerns, etc, so we do already have some sense of the way the chart is going to go. Not so with a plain chart. So in addition to the many house systems, this could go either way. We will see!

Chart A

I forgot the other comment about Chart A, I wanted to make was Venus and Jupiter in the 8th. That I put because his chart is "other people oriented" and the 8th is active, not only was he involved in "other people's finances" but debts. ie, I see now taxes!

That is interesting, as in my experience, I have noticed that when the 8th house is negatively active by progressions, transits, etc., and if the natal reflects it, large debts long ago forgotten tend to surface.

I realize that Schmidt (or was it Zoller?), I think Schmidt, has said no, to that and it only indicated inheritance. But I disagree wtih that as I have seen the debt issue pop up a few times, not enough to say for certain, only 3 times for certain, with 3 different people. So this mystery chart was very enlightening in that sense regarding the 8th house issues of debts, other people's money, finances, taxes, judgements, as well as the natives money, and his huge debts of lawyers and lawsuits. Very enlightening!

Just to say that I thought both Paul's and Morning Sun's analyses of chart A (on p.1) were quite impressive, close on a number of points (not just the mother influence, for MorningSun). Paul's suggestions of someone who stands up for the underdog and causes, makes a noise, needs to be heard, public figure, who brought problems on himself seems quite accurate.
Atlantean suggested a revolutionary politician, which is of course close but is a bit vague, and no reasons were given, except that it was just from a "cursory glance". Perhaps we'd all do better if we just gave the charts a cursory glance, before too much thinking kicks in and messes things up...
Graham

hi graham,

as you mentioned in a pm to me back when i did the other mystery chart exercise - the benefit is not so much in the guessing but in seeing the astrological rationale for why folks here are saying what they say.. that to me is where we get to learn from one another.

morning sun - i like the additional comments you've made on chart 2 as that all makes sense to me too! will be fun to see who this person is!!