Consider that Intuition can be mixed up with wishful thinking, a grey area indeed.

Rod wrote:

Consider that Intuition can be mixed up with wishful thinking, a grey area indeed.

Logical thinking can be biassed.

RodJM wrote:Consider that Intuition can be mixed up with wishful thinking, a grey area indeed.

Then by distinction is logical thinking therefore hopeless? Or is this a non-sequitur?
MJ

Mjacob wrote:

Then by distinction is logical thinking therefore hopeless? Or is this a non-sequitur?

This is a non sequitur, and an example for what I mean, Matthew.

The art is to find the right mixture of logic and intuition.

Michael

There seems to be general confusion here as to what is meant by "logical" and what the Moon's traits are. Let's begin with synonyms for "logical" from Roget's Thesaurus: clear, rational, coherent, valid, sound, cogent [meaning very clear and easy for the mind to accept and believe] , relevant, pertinent, consistent, analytical, sensible

The antonyms (opposite) of these are: confused, chaotic, illogical, irrational, inconstant. Now if we search ancient texts for those words (Lee Lehman's Book of Rulerships) we find one of those term listed once: Al Biruni lists confused for Saturn. We might discard that since it has no support from other authors either before or after Al Biruni.

Now let's look at lunar traits. One trait listed as an antonym for logical shows up in ancient texts. That word is "inconstant." Gadbury gives that trait to the Moon.

If we come to the modern research of the Gauquelins, we do find support for that single term of inconstant: "inconstant" and "changeable." Other traits the Gauquelins found connected to the Moon are: "illusions (prone to them), imaginative, inexact, confused, dreamer, unmethodical." And one big one for astrologers who prefer to make themselves their own authority, bypassing tradition and research: "Unauthoritarian."

Would you as an astrologer prefer to utilize those traits in reading a birth chart or horary?

So if we're talking about intuition, tradition and modern research don't support that term as belonging to the Moon. We might define intuition as the ability to understand or "tune into" a client because we somehow understand (intuition) where the client is coming from without that client telling us.

There is no conflict at all between true intuition and logic. They would support each other, for the universe operates on strictly logical mathematical principles. However, as human beings we are all prone to faulty intuition which then becomes only imagination. In that case we have stepped into the lunar realm.

Intuition isn't a concept found in ancient texts. It's a modern concept, and most likely belongs to Uranus or Neptune or both. That is exactly where Rex Bill's The Rulership Book places intuition: "Uranus, Neptune, 9th house." So it appears to be a false assumption that intuition as such is a lunar trait. As astrologers I believe we would all like to say we use clear logic in our astrological work combined with a helpful dose of intuition.

First off I do find it hard to imagine that humanity only learnt intuition once someone discovered Uranus. Hallucinogens have been used since time immemorial but according to modern astrology they were only invented since the discovery of Neptune.
It takes a great leap of imagination to believe that a zodiac chart is reality. You need to imagine imaginary lines in the sky dividing arbitrary twelfth divisions and then decide where the house divisions lie except that nobody can. To say that judgements based on these criteria are logical is absurd.
Whether this delusion is caused by the moon or Neptune I do not know.

According to the Gauquelins the Moon has some traits that can be helpful in interpersonal relationships and counseling: "affable, friendly, generous, charitable, sociable, tolerant, welcoming..."

For the most part ancient texts didn't give psychological meanings to the Moon, so the Gauquelin work is ground breaking. Check out the Gauquelin books. Good reading! We just need to know which traits go with which planets. That's what makes a good perceptive astrologer.

Therese Hamilton wrote: For the most part ancient texts didn't give psychological meanings to the Moon, so the Gauquelin work is ground breaking. Check out the Gauquelin books. Good reading! We just need to know which traits go with which planets. That's what makes a good perceptive astrologer.

Well said Therese,

Perhaps another thread discussing each members views on "logic" and "intuition" should be instigated?

RodJM wrote:

Perhaps another thread discussing each members views on "logic" and "intuition" should be instigated?

Rod, a big problem with modern astrology is that there are too many "views" as such, when we really need to pay attention to accepted definitions. I see that we need to truly understand the planets and other concepts apart from mere opinion.

There seems to be a prevalent view that we can build our own foundation on our own opinions.That's not really the way truth works. In all fields it's first necessary to obtain a firm foundation in basics. Then practice in the field for a number of years. That's where we obtain the right to begin adding our own ideas based on experience.

Mjacob wrote:

RodJM wrote:Consider that Intuition can be mixed up with wishful thinking, a grey area indeed.

Then by distinction is logical thinking therefore hopeless? Or is this a non-sequitur?
MJ

I didn't mention logical thinking in my statement. The whole concept of Intuition should be taken by the perspective of either psychological or philosophical. If we are to debate this, what side are we taking?

Therese Hamilton wrote:RodJM wrote:

Perhaps another thread discussing each members views on "logic" and "intuition" should be instigated?

Rod, a big problem with modern astrology is that there are too may "views" as such, while we really need to pay attention to accepted definitions. I see that we mainly need to REALLY understand the planets and other concepts apart from mere opinion. That's my view, anyway.

Oh yeah, of course, just look at all the practically endless discussions on various forums all over the world on the subject of astrology, in its many guises and forms. Paying attention to accepted definitions would be first step towards hauling it into academia.