Display posts from previous
Sort by

85 by Tom
thanks for your additional thoughts to which i can appreciate and yes to your question too.. i have read some strong criticism on dr h's rectification work in the book you mention.. it is all relative i suppose.. btw when you get a chance, a few of us were wondering where you got the data for joshua powell on another thread. thanks.. - solar fire gives me 0 aq 55 for ascendant with this time you have provided.. lmt is being used.
I've read strong criticism for almost everything I've ever read: astrology and elsewhere. Unless and until someone shows me the perfect astrologer who has nothing but perfect information, I'll place confidence where I see fit.

I do not recall where I got the information on Joshua Powell and in fact I had to look him up just now to see who he is or was. I know I didn't make it up.

The data I posted for Polk works out nicely on Janus. Not sure where the problem is nor do I care. Polk was not the thrust of the exercise.

The coordinates may be different;
80 W 53' 33"
35N 04' 59"

And they are. Solar Fire gives different coordinates. The coordinates used above produce the chart given in Solar Fire. Saturn rules the ASC in both cases.

86 by Nixx
Yes Astrodienst have this:

Pineville, SC (US): 33n26, 80w02, South Carolina

Do you know who rectified his chart Tom, and was this from a time given for him that was seen as a bit dubious ?

87 by james_m
nixx,

tom mentions it is the mysteriouso (monk tune) "Dr. H" in his book on american presidents, that rectified polks chart..

mark,

i am speaking generally on all astrologers and not you specifically. it was based on you pointing out moon on an angle for chart 1 at the top of your 604pm post.. chart 2 has the same and the chart is nocturnal which i why i point out this difference of nocturnal verses diurnal for the 2 charts while wondering of its relevance if any.. angularity counts more for me too which is why chart 1 was especially interesting with all the planets on angles, until i found out about it was the result of someone's rectification process.. at any rate i see the distinctions you're making in your 604pm post.. it helps inform me on your decision making process. thanks for that..

88 by Mark
James_M wrote:
mark,

i am speaking generally on all astrologers and not you specifically. it was based on you pointing out moon on an angle for chart 1 at the top of your 604pm post.. chart 2 has the same and the chart is nocturnal which i why i point out this difference of nocturnal verses diurnal for the 2 charts while wondering of its relevance if any.. angularity counts more for me too which is why chart 1 was especially interesting with all the planets on angles, until i found out about it was the result of someone's rectification process.. at any rate i see the distinctions you're making in your 604pm post.. it helps inform me on your decision making process. thanks for that..
I note Astrodatabank cite the chart a few minutes earlier and the source is cited as
D.C. Doane, "Horoscopes of U.S. Presidents." Same in Constellations '77 "as recorded in his diary."
http://www.astro.com/astro-databank/Polk,_James_Knox

I dont see this changing that much to the delineations offered. The Moon is still in the 7th by sign division and WS houses. The 12:00 LMT noon birth time or 17:23 UT/GMT (I understand why Dr H is suspicious of it!) has Venus right on the MC and the Sun closer to the MC too. Jupiter is not as close to the ASC. I must admit that chart would have been trickier to delineate with the prominence it gives to the debilitated Venus.

There is a wider point though about angularity depending on its use with WS and quadrant houses. There is a more significant difference in delineations in chart 2 depending on whether you use quadrant or WS houses. I have delineated the Moon as operating in the angular 7th WS house. People using quadrant houses would see it as lying in the 6th. This is an important difference since as the ruler of the 5th house and the sect light the Moon has added significance as a vocational indicator if the chart is that of an actor. Indeed the whole emphasis shifts with the Moon, Mercury and Venus in the 7th. Having said all this if we are discussing planetary strength as opposed to house placement I still utilise a planets proximity to the angles by looking at the chart by sign division too.

Mark
As thou conversest with the heavens, so instruct and inform thy minde according to the image of Divinity William Lilly

89 by Tom
Pineville, SC (US): 33n26, 80w02, South Carolina
Polk was born in 1795. Boundaries change, names of towns change etc. I couldn't find the location in Virginia where George Washington was born because of such changes. What is now Kentucky was Virginia until 1792. West Virginia didn't exist as a separate entity until the Civil War. Until then it was part of VIrginia. This is the sort of thing that happens when charts are very old. It's just that it affected a time when the signs were changing. This could happen today if the birth was in one part of a large city or county, and the astrology program gives the coordinates of City Hall (as they tend to do) in another part.

90 by Paul
Well I feel more confident then that Chart 2 is the actor. I was torn between this chart and chart 2 for the actor.

Btw, what I'm learning from these threads, other than the astrology, is that I have NO idea who these people are!

91 by Tom
Our businessman is, to say the least, unconventional and as I mentioned he is known for other things. And this is kind of sad because he was a very successful executive. I still recall the first time I saw him on National TV. It was election night, November 1976. He was sitting in a rocking chair on his front porch in Georgia rocking back and forth with this broad grin on his face, obviously drunk, as well as happy. ?Well,? he drawled, ?It looks like I got me a brother that is Pres-y-dent of the Yew-nahted States!? The Democrats successfully kept Billy Carter, chart No 3, under wraps until after the election. They were less successful in that endeavor from then on.

Many Presidents have family members whom, I?m sure they love, but I?m just as sure they wish they would keep out of the limelight. Richard Nixon had a brother who allegedly had run-ins with the law ? may have even done time. Ditto Roger Clinton, and even Hillary wasn?t immune. None them, however, were good copy like Billy Carter, the stereotypical Southern Good ol? Boy. Billy would later hang around with Libyan officials, urinate in public, be outspoken often while under the influence, and generally make the President wish he would shut up. During an interview in Playboy Magazine he was asked how things had changed in Plains, Georgia, his home and location of the family peanut business, Billy replied succinctly (for national publication no less), ?Plains is shot in the ass.?

Billy?s drinking was such that he even had a beer named after him: Billy Beer. It didn?t last, it was the most godawful tasting beverage ever brewed. Rumor had it Billy himself wouldn?t drink it. Unopened cans of Billy Beer are now hot collectors? items.

Yet Billy was a successful business executive. Jimmy Carter and the Democrats tried to portray the business as a small family owned kind of Mom and Pop operation. Nothing could be further from the truth. It was a multi-million dollar operation long ago, very successful and made more successful by Billy?s efforts from what I?ve read. Brother Jimmy was not as interested in that sort of life. Jimmy graduated from the US Naval Academy, had a degree in nuclear engineering and went into politics becoming the governor of Georgia before running for President. His was the first elected post Watergate administration and he ran in the primaries by starting his stump speeches this way: I?m Jimmy Carter and I am not a lawyer.? It worked.

After his front porch interview, Billy became famous, his alcoholism grew worse (he went for treatment in 1979) and he died in 1988 of pancreatic cancer at the age of 51.

Having one of the lights, particularly the light of sect, in the 10th is an indication of fame. But in detriment the fame is either for the wrong reasons or doesn?t last. Billy may have enjoyed the limelight, but he was considered something of a joke, and given his abilities in business that wasn?t a fair assessment of the man. His political judgment wasn?t the best. He had to register as a foreign agent due to his dealings with Libya. He even ran for mayor of Plains, but was defeated.

His Sun in the 3rd quadrant house is representative of his brother (exalted). Venus is strong in Taurus and rules the MC, but is retrograde (works against the native). I mentioned the two non-actor charts had something in common: both James Polk and Billy Carter come from agricultural backgrounds.

Billy?s ASC ruler is in Pisces, a most uncomfortable location for Saturn. Saturn is sextile Jupiter in Capricorn (fall) a good indication of excess. Furthermore they are in mutual reception. Jupiter rules the 12th (self undoing) and is feeding Saturn (weak Lord ASC) and Saturn feeds Jupiter. It?s a vicious cycle.

Billy Carter
March 29, 1937
12:30 AM CST
Americus, GA*

*Some biographical articles list Plains as the birth place. The coordinates are only minutes apart. Data as posted is from Rodden rated A. The American Book of Charts

92 by margherita
I see I was wrong :(

Giving a quick look to the last two charts it seems to me- but somebody already told this- rulership on MC is less important, the phase is more important.

Difficult to say more, I remember very little Jimmy Carter (I don't want to say how old I was when he served as President), and never heard about all the natives- even the past ones, I will read your descriptions in order to connect life with planetary configurations.

Nice game, I liked a lot,
margherita
Traditional astrology at
http://heavenastrolabe.wordpress.com

95 by Mark
Yes thanks Tom! :'

Sorry I got a bit too caught up in the chart analysis. There is no doubt this new 3 chart approach is a significant improvement on the old format. I feel like you have given us a real astro work out over the last few weeks with these two mystery chart challenges. So much so I have been diverting all my energy here and neglecting the mundane forum :oops:

Its a pity you cant really contribute yourself and offer us a Morin inspired delineation of the charts. Maybe you should get someone to host this now and again to allow you to participate yourself?

So who is the mystery actor? :???:

Mark
As thou conversest with the heavens, so instruct and inform thy minde according to the image of Divinity William Lilly

96 by Tom
Chart No. 2 is the actor Charles, better known by his middle name Robert Redford

Aug 18, 1936
8:02 PM + 8 Hours
Santa Monica, CA, USA

Redford studied painting as well as acting. He had parts in popular 1950s TV programs and began a film career in the 1962. He established himself with some film successes in the mid 1960s. He turned down roles in ?Who?s Afraid of Virginia Wolfe,? and ?The Graduate,? fearing he would become a blonde good boy stereotype. He was paired with Paul Newman for the first time in the extremely popular Butch Cassidy and The Sundance Kid in 1969.

He had an initial success directing with the critically acclaimed ?Ordinary People,? (1980) and won an Academy Award for Best Director. He directed another well received motion picture, ?A River Runs Through it? as well as a few others.

Redford is known for his support of left wing political causes and candidates for office. He is also well known for his philanthropy.

Jupiter rules his MC and ASC and is very strong in Sagittarius in the 9th. If a strong planet has to be in a cadent house, it may as well be the 9th. But for whole sign advocates Jupiter is in the 10th sign and the Venus, Mercury Moon in Virgo are then angular in the 7th sign. Moon Mercury contacts are nice as they give a balanced mind or one that is both rational and imaginative. Only 7 months older than Billy Carter, Saturn is in Pisces, too, but tucked away in the 12th house.

Mars in the 7th shows interest in athletics and Redford was a decent baseball player and tennis player. He was good enough to warm up Richard ?Pancho? Gonzales, one of the best players in the world in his prime.

With all those planets in Virgo and Virgo on the 7th I was curious about his first wife, Lola Van Wagenen. I can only find a birth year (1940), not a date. He did marry her when the Sun was in Virgo, however. Their marriage lasted 30 years before ending in divorce.

!! Read first: forum policies
Recent topics
Post Reply

Return to “Traditional (& Ancient) Techniques”