Skyscript Astrology Forum

Ile,

i note pluto is in a direct square to your natal sun from 2 degree scorpio 05... when mars gets directed to the square of the sun, it also conjoins pluto.. i realize some folks don't use these outer dwarf planets, but i am passing this along, as i happened to take a look for myself..

here is a bastardization of one thing i do when i look at an astrology chart. i note the degree difference between things.. the reason i refer to it as a 'bastardization of things' is it is a simplified 1 degree= 1 year formula that seems to bear fruit.. using your chart, the 4 degree gap shows up not only from mars to sun- 90 + 4, but also with mars to pluto = 4, descendant to sun = 4, ascendant axis to pluto = 90 + 4, pof to midheaven = 4, and etc. etc.
this is a type of solar arc direction with the eyeball that i am doing.. as i was saying earlier on in this thread, there are some direct connections between primary directions and solar arc directions, however those who practice primary directions exclusively seem loath to want to acknowledge this and those who practice solar arc directions exclusively without looking into primary directions, will not be aware of this.. at any rate, it is something for anyone who has taken the time to read this thread or my post to consider and explore further..

James writes:

one thing i do when i look at an astrology chart. i note the degree difference between things.. it is a simplified 1 degree= 1 year formula that seems to bear fruit.

This seems very sensible, and I do it too, as I'm sure many do - for one thing, it's a good and quick way to make a rough guess at what primary directions are worth checking, even though of course many of the leads will turn out to be false once it's all expressed in semi-arcs in RA.

Graham

james_m wrote:Ile,

i note pluto is in a direct square to your natal sun from 2 degree scorpio 05... when mars gets directed to the square of the sun, it also conjoins pluto.. i realize some folks don't use these outer dwarf planets, but i am passing this along, as i happened to take a look for myself..

here is a bastardization of one thing i do when i look at an astrology chart. i note the degree difference between things.. the reason i refer to it as a 'bastardization of things' is it is a simplified 1 degree= 1 year formula that seems to bear fruit.. using your chart, the 4 degree gap shows up not only from mars to sun- 90 + 4, but also with mars to pluto = 4, descendant to sun = 4, ascendant axis to pluto = 90 + 4, pof to midheaven = 4, and etc. etc.
this is a type of solar arc direction with the eyeball that i am doing.. as i was saying earlier on in this thread, there are some direct connections between primary directions and solar arc directions, however those who practice primary directions exclusively seem loath to want to acknowledge this and those who practice solar arc directions exclusively without looking into primary directions, will not be aware of this.. at any rate, it is something for anyone who has taken the time to read this thread or my post to consider and explore further..

Hi James,

Thank you for sharing your views regarding my chart.
I don't use outer planets but don't make war against those who uses them.

There are some striking transits to my personal points which are shown by the outer planets, though I was able pretty well to note them with the traditional techniques.

For example, somewhere in the early February when Pluto conjunct my natal Mercury, I become strongly involved into traditional astrology, and almost obsessed with it, leaving all else and engaged myself in intense studies from the early morning till the late night everyday since
Now, this kind of passion is usual description for Pluto; also the keyword 'transformation', deep studies [Pluto/Mercury] and etc.

I'm betraying my traditional fellows at this moment, but speaking symbolically this pretty much fits the whole story

As I said, I'm doing good with using only the 5 planets and the 2 Lights, but I really don't want to be with a fixed opinions that this is the only workable approach.
Though, I must admit I have problems with some descriptions of the houses, like 8th for sex and transformation and etc., just because I can't find any logic of this fitting into the whole story of house interrelationship.

Another interesting 'coincidence' with the modern planets is that I started to be interested in Astrology (back than in modern) when Uranus transited 9th house.

As I said, I have back-up for this into my favorite traditional techniques.
For example, since we are at primary directions. This year Sun through primary motion came to the place of Mercury. So, Sun as almuten of 10th, coming to Mercury ruler of 3rd, can also indicate my engagement into learning, collecting, researching, using my reasoning faculties and even pursuing this as a career (Sun almuten of 10th).

For the Uranus thing. When I started with Astrology, the zodiacal releasing of Spirit (actions, work, the intellectual place), came in the 10th from Fortune, which is indicator of actions, profession and etc., and here I have Jupiter as ruler of natural 9th (astrology) alongside Mercury, natural significator of astrologers.

So, it is a matter of symbolism in my opinion [for my current humble opinion Astrology is a symbolical interpretation of the astronomical events into metaphysical, or if you will, philosophical language]. I choose to use this symbolism and for me it works and it is right. But I do not fight with the others who use different approach [though I must admit I was in temptation several times to do that]. I really think there is no need for that.

Regards,
Ile

Ile wrote:
So, it is a matter of symbolism in my opinion [for my current humble opinion Astrology is a symbolical interpretation of the astronomical events into metaphysical, or if you will, philosophical language]. I choose to use this symbolism and for me it works and it is right. But I do not fight with the others who use different approach [though I must admit I was in temptation several times to do that]. I really think there is no need for that.

Regards,
Ile

thanks for your comments Ile.. i especially like this quote.. i agree with your line of thinking for the rest of your comments too.. it's up to the individual astrologer to find what works and has meaning and to work out from this vantage point.. the beauty of a more traditional approach is it is steeped in some type of tradition that has given a lot of meaning to other astrologers down thru history.. if we were able to go back in history it might be that we would find much diversity and variance in these past astrologers approach and indeed i think that is what we find.. i myself am into diversity and letting each person find meaning in their own personal way. i think this is what we are all doing here to the best of our abilities.. thanks again for sharing.

MorningSun wrote:Back to Basics, the deaths, short length of life should be in the Radix. The Natal Chart should show it. It is a maternal familial death of both children. Their destiny is strongly tied to their mothers fate.

The closest explanation I feel, is Petr's below, but still not there. We are missing something. An opportunity to discover a new concept in interpretation is presenting itself to us. I don't think we've figured it out yet.

Petr wrote:SolarFire and Janus evaluate correctly that horoscope is preventional. Therefore chosen as hyleg PF. They forget, as Martin said, that Ptolemy recognized as hylegical place 10, 1, 11, 7 and 9 houses. Therefore hyleg is ascendant. Only Porfhyrius Magus hyleg determined correctly. Arab astrologers would consider Moon or PF. Candidates for alchocoden are at Asc - Moon and Mars. Moon gives about 4.9 years of life. Mars gives a little over 7 years. Moon or PF gives as hyleg Saturn. Here it is difficult to assess the effect of the Moon. When you subtract the full years and considering the influence of Mars, we can get into negative numbers. In any event alchocoden shows a small life span (better life force).

Martin"s Statement: " There is a little more in the profections, primarily Mars on the MC squaring the ascendant, with the Sun (ruler of the ascendant in my, sidereal, book) opposing this Mars by transit."

Also gives a good explanation using profections. Still no cigar though, Back to the Natal Chart.

Lihin,

I also agree with Lihin, regarding Saturn and drowning. I is puzzling me also. Saturn in Virgo, earth sign also. Saturn is generally associated with cold and dry. Saturn with the Moon, the moon giving the water element, not Saturn, then I could relate to Saturn/Moon and drowning, that would make sense Perhaps cold muddy water, which I have seen/read as a significator of Saturn. . But Saturn in Virgo, not so much.

Williams chart is a bit easier to see his fate as Martin stated, it is very weak, as both charts are, however I still don't feel there is an adequate explanation for an early death FROM THE NATAL CHART.

Its got to be there and very clearly, for such a horrific, shocking death, which made major news in the area.

In Abigails, Solar Return, eight days after her death Mars is conjunct her Natal Saturn in Virgo, a very violent aspect, I could also make a good case for Pluto and Saturn, however, most of you would discount that. I do have to say, even though Pluto is not longer a planet, I do find lately, the theme of death with Pluto coming up all over the place lately. If many of you use points, fixed stars and any number of lots, why would it be so difficult to associate Pluto with death or even use Pluto. Lately its been very active in pointing death out to me. Any one else? something to look at possibly. I have an opened mind.

Its in the Natal, I don't believe we have discovered the reason yet, but close. Any other Theories out there? We are as intelligent as Ptolemy, Valens, Morin, Lilly, and as experienced. Ptolemy wasn't even an astrologer! He sat back and reviewed others work, and made his own conclusions, albeit pretty good ones. But ....... there is more to this, we just have to keep at it, and we may discover something new!

Very agree with you!!!

I wish someone can explain what these directions mean :
Saturn trine converse direction to sun "my hyleg"
Mars sextile converse direction to ascendant
Both are malefic directions happen in 2018 , Mars is the out of sect malefic in my tenth house Aries conjuntcs MC Saturn 2:45 scorpio. These two planets will be in capricorn my seventh house in my 2018 solar return chart squaring the natal sun&Mars in Aries

Thank you