i wanted to thank mark for all the work he put into organizing and accumulating the many astrological posts on this 2024 election..

the fact that maybe 1/3rd predicted trump is interesting.. one could say the election hasn't been completed until the inauguration process - jan 2025, but the results at this point seem fairly clear in who has won...

so how do so many astrologers get it wrong?? it is external influences which shape the astrological conclusions?? or is it because it is generally too close to call and a complicated election process - electoral college - and etc?

i think personal bias is a strong factor.. it is hard to dispel..

James wrote:

The fact that maybe 1/3rd predicted trump is interesting.. one could say the election hasn't been completed until the inauguration process - jan 2025, but the results at this point seem fairly clear in who has won...

At this point Trump seems to have clearly won the popular and electoral vote. Even those who said that Kamala Harris would be inaugurated suggested that it would seem that Trump had won on the election date. Some psychics have been firmly saying for years that Harris would be inaugurated in 2025. Joni Patry suggests in her latest video that it's possible an attempt would be made to "take the election away" from Trump. She always strongly predicted a Trump win.

So how do so many astrologers get it wrong?? it is external influences which shape the astrological conclusions?? or is it because it is generally too close to call and a complicated election process - electoral college - and etc?

i think personal bias is a strong factor.. it is hard to dispel..

Of course personal bias enters into election predictions. I watched the election returns until midnight California time, and the counts weren't close. Trump always had a comfortable lead toward the electoral vote total. Of course we have to wait for completed vote counts, but it doesn't seem likely that there will be any big changes. Also, let's wait for the coming important dates that certify the election:
December 17, 2024 when state electors vote for president and vice president.
January 6, 2024 Electoral College votes for each state are counted in congress.

I'm not calling it quits just yet. Retrograde Uranus is very active now in both Trump and Harris charts.

Therese wrote...
I'm not calling it quits just yet. Retrograde Uranus is very active now in both Trump and Harris charts.

Agree.
Let's not forget the retro Mars soon to come back to meet Pluto again. With Vulcanus sitting early Leo (mighty change in circumstances that occur with great speed).
Ouranos

thanks therese and ouranos for the response..

those will be interesting dates to watch... there has been a lot of speculation on trumps health.. i am not sure if there is any basis for it, but there appears to be astrologically which is why i think it remains an open question.. i do believe some have spoken of the strength of jd vances chart with the astrology, moving forward here...

i also had a few other ideas more philosophical in nature that i wanted to mention... is winning or losing a good/bad thing?? perhaps it is a blessing for the one who doesn't win to have to take on the great responsibility that goes with winning?? do favourable observations on a chart have to imply the perhaps wins, or is it possible that favourable astrological data allows for losing as well, which could end up being a positive in itself?? i don't ordinarily think this way, but it might be possible.. for this to be.. otherwise, how do we explain so many getting the results wrong?? and yes - we can wait until inauguration day - jan 20, 2025 to see what happens from here to then too, as a lot can happen in a short amount of time..

Ouranus wrote
Let's not forget the retro Mars soon to come back to meet Pluto again. With Vulcanus sitting early Leo (mighty change in circumstances that occur with great speed).
I noticed the psychic Amanda Ellis on her YT channel predicting the election was selecting the volcano card with respect to the election. As she worked through spirit connections & cards she began to intuit that something may occur before 20 January that would cause JD Vance to be inaugurated as Trumps replacement,

James wrote:

I also had a few other ideas more philosophical in nature that i wanted to mention... is winning or losing a good/bad thing?? perhaps it is a blessing for the one who doesn't win to have to take on the great responsibility that goes with winning?? do favourable observations on a chart have to imply the perhaps wins, or is it possible that favourable astrological data allows for losing as well, which could end up being a positive in itself??

This raises the all important question as to whether the astrological techniques we are using indicate psychological processes or hard core events as such, sometimes one and sometimes the other?! I still don't have the answer to that question.

zosma

yes, the ongoing mars-pluto opposition and the fact trump has had 2 assassination attempts on him this year.. scary but possible...

therese

i don't have an answer to that question either and i am not sure that one is ever going to be available..

I would like to add my thanks to Mark too - he did such a thorough job of recording the assesments and the main reasons behind them. My feet have just hit the ground again after travelling for most of the past week, so I am looking forward to catching up with the additions in his thread once I've got my breath back.

Thank you to James and Deb for your kind comments. I would also like to thank Deb for generously allowing me to utilise the Skyscript Mundane forum for these lists not just this year but also in previous presidential elections in 2016 and 2020. .

I think every astrologer that poured their efforts into this process should praised for making the effort and being willing to go public. I know its not easy for professional astrologers in particular with a client base to consider.

What is the Purpose of the List?
Some people have mistakenly thought I was preparing these lists as some sort of astrological ''Top the Pops'' to list the good or bad astrologers. Nothing could be further away from my motivation in doing this! I am most definitely not trying to knock down the reputations of any individual astrologer. There are clearly some excellent astrologers who I respect a lot who genuinely thought Harris would win. Watching their videos or reading their articles or posts its evident they often followed an impeccably clear and logical train of astrological logic.

I think a list like this provides an excellent opportunity to see and test out a vast array of techniques on display. But I generally prefer to take the personalities out of this process and just review the different techniques used to identify what seems to be working and what isn't. .

Political Partisanship, Bias and Neutrality
Of course it can be argued political partisanship is a factor in why so many astrologers got the election result wrong this year (and in previous years). I dont think its a secret that as a group astrologers in the USA as well as across the whole Anglosphere tend to be more left of centre politically. Its therefore more of a challenge for astrologers to predict against their beliefs for a candidate they strongly oppose. In some astrological Facebook groups I have also noticed a kind of group think where predicting against the favoured liberal or progressive candidate is perceived as a kind of betrayal. But while some will state astrologers should be totally neutral is that even possible? I know Wade Caves argues strongly its an impossibility since we all inevitably have our personal opinions, prejudices and POV shaped by our different life experiences. I think he has a point. Nevertheless, I do think as astrologers we should at least attempt to stay as detached as we possibly can. Being more generous in our delineations to ensure we see our preferred candidate gets over the line astrologically is not helping anyone. As prognosticators we should aim to be as objective as we can rather than cheerleaders for our chosen candidate.

Techniques compared
Regarding techniques frankly, none of the time lord lord systems ( dashas, zodiacal releasing or firdaria performed that well this year). Those that just relied on transits and lunations tended to do much better. Horary astrology actually did extremely well this year with 6 out of 7 predictions for a Trump win. Notwithstanding that impressive result I do have some have some concerns with using horary for elections but I will not stray into that controversial topic here! As someone that personally works with declination in my astrology I was disappointed to see that all 4 astrologers using it were unsuccessful. Three of those astrologers used the Secondary Progressed Moon by declination amongst other techniques. I actually think it is a powerful technique in showing a peak period of prominence for someone. But just like excellent transits they dont necessarily indicate success. John Frawley has previously suggested a person's chart can be lighted up like a Christmas tree with good transits in a Presidential election because they are going to reach an all time career and lifetime high even if not elected. Hence, I expect most people on earth have now heard the name of Kamala Harris. I personally, think there were some methodological errors in the way some astrologers approached declination. Its something I will personally revisit. I should also mention that in regards astrological techniques the so called inaugural Moon method proposed by an anonymous Skyscript member here back in 2009 has now correctly predicted 5 Presidential Elections in a row!

Astrological Traditions
In terms of astrological traditions the best performing was Uranian astrology with all 4 astrologers using Uranian bodies correctly predicting a Trump win. I haven't tabulated all the traditional astrologers yet but over 50% predicted a Harris win. Overall astrologers using medieval techniques did better than hellenistic astrologers since the latter heavily relied on zodiacal releasing to predict a Harris win. However, it should be stated 3 out of 4 astrologers using Firdaria suggested a Harris win. Similarly, there was low predictive accuracy by both Vedic astrology and Western siderealism overall this year. However, it should be pointed out that that one western siderealist astrologer (Kenneth Bowser) has now correctly predicted the last 3 Presidential elections in a row. He and the Serbian tropical mundane astrologer Smiljana Gavrancic are the only two astrologers on my lists to correctly identify the winner in each Presidential election in 2016, 2020 and 2024.

The Astrology of the Collective vs Nativities
Overall though I do question whether there isn't a philosophical problem with the way the vast majority of astrologers approached this election or any other election. With 345 million people in the USA and over 160 million registered voters is it really appropriate to just treat this like a glorified duel between two nativities? Medieval astrological authorities like Ibn Ezra proposed the astrological doctrine of ''subsumption'' which meant there is a hierarchy of charts and that in questions concerning a whole nation we should be referring to mundane charts of the collective like Jupiter-Saturn conjunctions, ingresses, eclipses, or pre-lunations. Without that dimension I think our astrology is lacking the wider collective context.

Post Election Follow Up
I still. have a few late entry applications to join the list from astrologers who have privately contacted me. This is a regular factor after lists go out. Oddly enough it never seems to be astrologers with unsuccessful predictions contacting me. I will spend a few weeks catching up on a few videos and tidying up the list. I will then see if I can get the results published. I want to analyse in more depth factors like nationality, gender, location, zodiac, astrological traditions and different techniques.

Mark

He [Kenneth Bowser] and the Serbian tropical mundane astrologer Smiljana Gavrancic are the only two astrologers on my lists to correctly identify the winner in each Presidential election in 2016, 2020 and 2024.

I'm not familiar with the work of Smiljana Gavrancic but I did note that Bowser predicted the return of Trump whilst making it clear that this is not something he hoped would happen personally, so he is clearly able to get over the personal bias factor.

Aristotle thinks that knowledge is something that is acquired through experience and reasoning.

The advantage of experience is that you have more tools. The disadvantage of experience is that you have more tools.

Reasoning should come down to being able to establish what stands out in front of our eyes.
I recommend reading the last weekly column of Ray Merriman where he quotes Kathy Rose.
Simple and down to earth.
https://www.mmacycles.com/free-weekly-f ... r-11-2024/

I would guess that if you were to tell 100 astrologers that one of the candidate has transiting Jupiter over his natal Sun ruling his ASC and trine his Jupiter in Libra, a large percentage would be right.
But somehow, we prefer more complicated issues.
Personally, I gave up early in predicting the outcome because I did not find what I was looking for (the complicated version) and I felt that the news and social medias were creating anxiety in me.

Appreciate the time Mark you took to give us a portray of where we are as a community in 2024.
Ouranos

I haven't looked into the US election astrologically for a while, but I remember seeing a clear change in some horoscope for Washington in the third week of January 2025, which meant that the old president would no longer be the new one. because the inauguration is on January 20th. Then Joe Biden withdrew from the candidacy and I no longer knew how to interpret the change. Because Mrs Harris wouldn't also be the same president. I think that with Neptune in Aries, the old world, in which skin color, gender, etc. were more important than qualifications and ability, is abdicating.