Skyscript Astrology Forum

Hi All:

I?m working with primary directions and I already figure out the most part of this complicated matter ... but I need in order to finalize my study a table to find the declination of a planet in a degree of longitude.
Do some of you have any idea of where can I find it?

I already know how to do directions between planets and angles, but now I need to calculate directions between planets not in angles, but in random points of the space and in order to do that I need the declination of the planets in several ecliptic degrees.

If some of you have any idea of how to find it, I would really appreciate!
I work with Janus and I have the Solar Fire as well, may be some of you have a hint of how to get the declination of a planet through some feature of both the software

Thank you in advance

Clelia

I don't know SF, but with Janus, select Calculate -> Planets Positions, and you're in business.

You can download my free program from http://mysite.verizon.net/vze6qirr/myindex.html. It will give you the table of positions, but also calculates zodiacal and mundo primary directions with a choice of several keys. You can use it to check your calculations (I based it on the algorithms in Rumen Kolev's booklets on primaries).

If you install the program on windows, and have SF installed, be sure to select SF's ephemeris directory. If you run into problems, let me know.

Bear in mind that there can be no strict table for the declinations, unless you're using zodiacal primaries (directing the planets' ecliptic intercepts), because the planets have varying celestial latitude.

- Ed

Hi Ed!

Thank you very much for the answer! I have Janus, and I prefer to work with Janus instead of the SF. and I suppose your software works with Janus as well!

The declination gave by the software Janus, though, is relative to the planet in the calculated chart: the software didn't give you the declination to, let's suppose ,a trine in the space from Jupiter to natal Sun. I want to know the declination of a special point in the space at for example 237 degrees( the point that directing Jupiter it will trine the Sun)

I can do this by constructing a chart where I put some celestial in the
position I need , so "cheating" the software it gives me the
declination. But I imagined that there was a table to do that;-)

you wrote:

You can download my free program from http://mysite.verizon.net/vze6qirr/myindex.html. It will give you the table of positions, but also calculates zodiacal and mundo primary directions with a choice of several keys. You can use it to check your calculations (I based it on the algorithms in Rumen Kolev's booklets on primaries).

If you install the program on windows, and have SF installed, be sure to select SF's ephemeris directory. If you run into problems, let me know.

Bear in mind that there can be no strict table for the declinations, unless you're using zodiacal primaries (directing the planets' ecliptic intercepts), because the planets have varying celestial latitude.


Hummm.... I have to understant that better!

Thank you again for your software: I?ll download it!
About Kolev?s software it is not giving to me the directions I get following the chart examples given by Zoller in his course. The directions to MC for example didn?t work. That is the reason I decided to calculate the directions by myself: but I have an awful spacial IQ

thank you again for your kindness!

Clelia[/color]
.

Hi Steven:

I agree 100% with you. It?s really a gift, but I have doubts I would be able some day to understand maths as I?m able to understand another concepts, the philosophical ones, for example.

I just wanted to say thanks and add a word to those who might use the Ptolemaic method of directions. This method maintains the ancients conception that the planets effects are on the Ecliptic and they were interested in the timeing of these effects which meant that these astrologers did not use the latitude of the planet in their calculations of "time" which was on the equator. But they did consider the latitude in delineation

The real Ptolemy?s method for directing is lost due the several translations. I?m working with the Medieval method, according to Alchabitius, in the same way that Bonatti used to work.

We need to use the latitude.
I?m studying Valens and he uses the ascencional time to do the directions: it?s an acient way of doing primary Directions. That study increased my interest in Primaries, so I?m studying them again.

Best regards

Clelia

If the results of Rumen's program differ from those of the Zoller course, and the same kind of directions are being calculated, then I'd say Zoller's results are much more likely to be incorrect. Rumen is the living master of primaries, as far as I'm concerned.

I had difficulty understanding what you're looking for wrt declinations. If a point has no celestial latitude, then there is a simple conversion of its longitude to declination. But more generally the latitude has to be taken into account and a more complex formula used to determine the declination.

Hi Ed:

I?ll try to explain better: Lets?suppose that I have a planet as significatos, for example the Sun, at 1 degree of Aries. If I want to know at what age Jupiter will trine the Sun, and in the chart that I?m working Jupiter is at 25 of Libra, there will be two possibilities of trine: when Jupiter will be at 1 of Sagittarius or at 1? of Leo.
Now to contruct this direction I need:Longitude, RA, Declination, Latitude, Ascentional Difference, Oblique Ascention, etc.
The software gives me the Right Ascention , declination and latitude for the Sun in the work chart, but didn?t give me the declination of Jupiter or an imaginary point at 1? of Saggittarius or 1? of Leo.
If you can help me with that I would appreciate very much

The Medieval primary Directions says to use as significators the Sun, Moon, MC, ASC, Prior Lunation and POF, so I must to direct the planets to these points. There are 3 kinds of Directions in Medieval Astrology: directing by RA, directing by OA and those direction involving not angular degrees.

Let?s me explain why I?m not satisfied with Placidus software. First I?ll show you how I did the calculations:
I wanted to direct the Ascendant to the Sun( directing by Oblique Ascention). To do this I found the ASC Oblique Ascention, that is RAMMC+90.
OA Ascendant =RA MC+90?

Next I found OA Sun under the terrestrial latitude of the Ascendent ( birthplace)This requires adjusting the Sun?s RA by the addition( since the declination of the Sun was South) of the Sun?s Ascentional Difference(AD). To find AD I used the formula sinAD=(tan declination) (tan of the latitude of the birthplace). The declination of the Sun taken from the ephemeris is 19S05 ( I don?t have the ephemeris and it is what I?m looking for, in this example the declination was given in the book). The latitude of the birthplace was 40n55

sinAD=(tan 19s05) (tan 40n55)
sin AD=(0.3459553) (0.8667365)
sin AD= 0.2998521
AD= sin (0.2998521)
AD=17.44872?
AD=17?27'

So, as I explained above, the declination being South I add the AD to the Sun?s RA( the Janus give that to us in the List of Planet?s positions)

As the Sun always has 0? of latitude I?ll take the RA as given in the list.

I get RA of the Sun= 307?06' 50"
AD of the Sun= 17?27' add
----------------------------------
=324?33'50"=OA Sun

Now I subtracted OA Sun from from the OA Asc;

OA Asc 349? 56'41"
OA Sun 324?33'50" subtract
------------------------------------
=025? 22' 51"= Arc of Direction

So, Arc of Direction=25 years,


Now the CONCLUSION: ASC conjunct SUN at 25 years, 4 months,12 days ( approx.)

I have in your program, Ed, this exact direction . So Zoller was not teaching nuts.
But the Placidus software is not showing the ASC conjunct Sun at any time!

Sorry the lengh of this post. You deserves to be canonised!

Clelia

Hello Clelia Romano,

I found in Daniele Jay's book : Le ciel en mouvement, p.33, Editon Sep Hermes, the fallowing formula:

sin decl: cos obliquity . sin lat + cos lat . sin obliquity . sin long

decl: declination of the planet
obliquity: obliquity of the eclipitic circle
lat: latitude of the planet
long: ecliptic longitude of the planet.

the author cites Danjon Andre, Astronomie generale, p. 60

Hope this helps

Hello Sasha!
Thank you for the formula, but I didn?t get what it means...seem to me that it is a way to find the sin of the declination? or not?l
I really didn?t understand what the formula is saying, but thank you for trying to help me!

sin decl: cos obliquity . sin lat + cos lat . sin obliquity . sin long

best regards

Clelia

It's easy

you have to use a soft or a mini-calculator.
here is a free soft that will do this calculations

http://www.wrotniak.net/works/midget/

don't forget to set the soft on

degree

,
in the default option is on radians

seem to me that it is a way to find the sin of the declination?

no, in order to detemine the declination, at the end of calculations, you must instruct the soft to calculate arcsin ( or, in the soft that I proposed asin) of the number you obtain.

So first calculate cos obliquity . sin lat + cos lat . sin obliquity . sin long.
second: calculate arcsin of the number you obtain from the first calculation

I found another one that is easy to use:

sin decl: sin obliquity . sin long

Hi Sasha!

So first calculate cos obliquity . sin lat + cos lat . sin obliquity . sin long.
second: calculate arcsin of the number you obtain from the first calculation

[/quote]

The problem is that I don?t have the obliquity of the planet: it?s not given in my software.

Thank you very much in the same way!

best

Clelia