Skyscript Astrology Forum

I recently started a new website for Hellenistic astrology at http://hellenisticastrology.com, and I wanted to let everyone know about it.

A large part of the focus of the website is a cooperative translation project for producing translations of Hellenistic astrological texts which will then be presented online to the public for free. Like many of you I have become somewhat impatient with the slow rate of publication of translations of Hellenistic astrological texts, so I thought that it was time for the astrological community to take matters back into their own hands, and to finally move forward with the revival of the Hellenistic tradition.

So far I have been working on the project with a group of friends, and we have already had two translations contributed to the site. Both are from texts that have never been translated and published anywhere before, as far as I know. They are still works in progress, but I thought that many of the people on this forum would find them interesting.

The first is a chapter from book 9 of Vettius Valens' Anthology where Valens is discussing the concept that would later become known as the decumbiture chart:

http://hellenisticastrology.com/wiki/in ... _Chapter_5

The second translation is from the later 'Hellenistic' author Rhetorius of Egypt where he outlines the topics and significations associated with the 12 places or houses:

http://hellenisticastrology.com/wiki/in ... lve_Places

I'm still in the process of entering in all of the Greek text for each of these translations, and we still have much work to do, but I wanted to let everyone know what we are up to.

We are still looking for new members to join us and to contribute to the project, particularly if they are bilingual, although we are pretty much open to anyone who feels that they have something useful that they could contribute to the project.

We feel like it is time to open up the study of Hellenistic astrology to the wider community, since the tradition belongs to all of us. If you would like to be involved then just let us know.

Here is the link to our main page again: http://hellenisticastrology.com

Chris,

Congratulations on this wonderful contribution to the field! This is exactly the sort of thing that is needed. My only regret is that Greek translation is still much too slow work for me. Hopefully in the future I will be able to contribute actively.

A question on translation policy: I noted that in the Rhetorius text, the Greek names of planets (Kronos, Ares, Zeus) alternate with the Latin/English names (Saturn, Mars, Jupiter). Is this deliberate? I for one would much prefer the latter variety.

Martin Gansten wrote:Chris,

Congratulations on this wonderful contribution to the field! This is exactly the sort of thing that is needed. My only regret is that Greek translation is still much too slow work for me. Hopefully in the future I will be able to contribute actively.

A question on translation policy: I noted that in the Rhetorius text, the Greek names of planets (Kronos, Ares, Zeus) alternate with the Latin/English names (Saturn, Mars, Jupiter). Is this deliberate? I for one would much prefer the latter variety.

Thanks! We would love to have you on board at some point in the future.

No, the alternations between the names of the planets was not deliberate. I just haven't gone through and fully edited the translation yet. What is nice about the wiki format is that you can go through and see all edits made to the text though, so you can see the evolution of the translation and well as any changes that were made to it. For example, here is a history log for the Rhetorius page: http://hellenisticastrology.com/wiki/in ... on=history

I will go through an standardize the names of the planets now.

One of the important projects that we are going to focus on is the standardization of the technical terminology of Hellenistic astrology. At the moment Robert Schmidt is the only person I'm aware of who has really given this area much focus, although he tends towards literal translations of most terms, whereas we will probably be trying to find more of a middle ground in order to bring the Hellenistic terminology more in line with later conventions where it seems appropriate.

For example, I think its ridiculous at this point to continue to transliterate the term 'zoidion' in the translations, as Schmidt apparently continues to do, with Greenbaum and Crane following his lead, and instead we will be consistently translating this term as 'sign'. However, other terms such as 'topos' will be translated more literally as 'place' instead of the modern usage of 'house', since this could make for some confusion in the translations since the Greek term for a 'house' was usually applied to the signs within the context of planetary rulership. That is to say, there is an important conceptual reason for retaining the Greek meaning of the term. In other areas we will adopt the more common conventions of referring to the names of the signs, for example in saying 'Aquarius' instead of the more literal 'Water-Pourer'.

There are still many discussions to be had about these translation conventions, although my hope is that it will help in establishing some sort of acceptable community wide standard that can be used in the future for the translation of the ancient texts.

Let me be the first to congratulate you on a great project!

I think Martin got there before you, so you will have to be second. And I'll be third But whilst you were writting this, I was busy posting a comment to the forum there, because I wanted to be the first to congratulate everyone in the place itself!

It is very impressive. I hope it expands on a benevolent spirit.

Thanks for letting us know about this Chris.

For example, I think its ridiculous at this point to continue to transliterate the term 'zoidion' in the translations, as Schmidt apparently continues to do, with Greenbaum and Crane following his lead.

I can't speak for her of course, and I shouldn't even try, but I remember Dorian speaking to me about this and saying something about she may be reversing an earlier policy. I don't want to misrepresent her views, but mention this as a suggestion to check this with her - I think she is more likely to incline towards the word sign herself.

However, other terms such as 'topos' will be translated more literally as 'place' instead of the modern usage of 'house'

I like that. It leaves it open for the argument about whether whole-sign was a system or a convenience to be developed without being restricted by confusing terminology.

Your approach sounds very good to me.

What a great idea!!
Wonderful

Chris, I'm so grateful to you for the new website, for your generosity (and that of your colleagues) in sharing your knowledge, and your dedication to uncovering the treasures of Hellenistic astrology. This is a great service to all of us, and much appreciated.

To Chris,

CONGRATS!!!

Just what we need. A benevolent generous astrology scholar

CONGRATS

Hello Chris,

Hope it not too late to say thanks for offering this and wishing you every success for the future of this project.

This site will defintely be one to watch!

Mark

A convincing project and website. I've been particularly interested by CCAG, enfin available ! ...

Note Chris, that you don't give "CCAG 5 - Part 4", but twice CCAG 6. (If it can be corrected). May I ask you if you made the PDF from images available elsewhere ?

For Manilius, you can add :
Astronomica [or] Astronomicon
Venice, [Bernardinus Venetus], [c. 1498-1500] [and]
Venice, Aldus Manutius, 1499
here : http://gallica.bnf.fr/ark:/12148/bpt6k58540j
and there : http://diglib.hab.de/show_image.php?dir ... mage=00387

And a French translation here : http://gallica.bnf.fr/ark:/12148/bpt6k282088n

It can be add also many versions of Ptolemy's Tetrabiblos and of ps-Ptolemy's Centiloquium.


Patrice
CURA

patrice_guinard wrote:A convincing project and website. I've been particularly interested by CCAG, enfin available ! ...

Note Chris, that you don't give "CCAG 5 - Part 4", but twice CCAG 6. (If it can be corrected). May I ask you if you made the PDF from images available elsewhere ?

For Manilius, you can add :
Astronomica [or] Astronomicon
Venice, [Bernardinus Venetus], [c. 1498-1500] [and]
Venice, Aldus Manutius, 1499
here : http://gallica.bnf.fr/ark:/12148/bpt6k58540j
and there : http://diglib.hab.de/show_image.php?dir ... mage=00387

And a French translation here : http://gallica.bnf.fr/ark:/12148/bpt6k282088n

It can be add also many versions of Ptolemy's Tetrabiblos and of ps-Ptolemy's Centiloquium.


Patrice
CURA

Thanks for pointing that out Patrice! I have fixed the link to the CCAG. The scans of the CCAG were given to me last year by Rob Hand, except for 8, part 4 which I found on archive.org. Google Books has also scanned several volumes of the CCAG over the past year or so. I have printed copies of some of the other volumes that I hope to have scanned soon, although some of the later ones are not in the public domain yet, so I don't think that I can post them.

I am currently looking for a scan of Franz Cumont's book L?Egypte des astrologues, and I have some translators lined up to work on it as soon as its available. I have a printed edition of it, but I wanted to see if anyone else had a scan first before I go through the trouble of unbinding my copy in order to scan it properly. Anyone?

Thanks for the additional links. I will post them on the site soon. Thanks to everyone else for your support and well-wishes.