With my scarce knowledge I tried to do an electional for a moment to propose and idea to a group of people. It was awful. Can anyone knowlegeable about electional comment what went so wrong?

It was an idea about travelling for the people of the group, a group with a very definite ideology, it was about friendship, groups, relationships, travelling, sharing, and second it was about convincing the others about the goodness of the idea. It was disgraceful, a complete fiasco, not a refuse, but not even a single response I am devastated

I suppose the mistake was focusing too much on the nature of the matter. I wanted a good 9th house, love it the Moon domiciled there, and Mercury domiciled too, acceptable 5th house because could be about dating too occasionally. The planet representing me the announcer was angular in MC I thought that would be enough to give me profile.

It is true lack of connection between this Venus and the planet representing the others, Mars, whats more in XIth, that worried me, but you know heavens are rotten these days and is difficult to find a good moment for anything.
I had hopes Spica ascending will sooth shortcomings over and be in general a lucky moment. I ve used events charts when something suddenly happens, folowing Lilly, to see if something bad was coming, and the chart looked bad, but Spica was ascending and I found that in the end nothing happened.

Also because of its collective nature, I didnt care to refer to natal, but to make things worse about Venus and Mars, they represent exactly the same in my natal, Venus me is wonderful and Mars is disgraceful, my thing in life is "hell is the others" as in the Sartre's quotation.

So badly done I suppose. Sorry second electional ever dont be hard on me

Here is the electional
Here is my natal in case you need to have a look. Thanks a lot.

Sorry your meeting went badly! Not sure how it would be in Regio (I think Mercury rules the 8th too), but Mercury rules the 11th in the 8th square Mars.... A meeting where you talk and whatnot is a Mercury thing, IMO. Mars is the 7th ruler in the 11th, so that may be those people listening to your case. Mars is a difficult influence in your natal too, so it may have surfaced that stuff. I realize that Mercury is dignified and receives Mars and disposits it, but that's still a difficult aspect there and I have seen it manifest badly in a few horaries via disagreements, arguments, physical fights, etc. Plus, Sun square Saturn is a competitive aspect. Otherwise it wasn't so bad. Venus on the MC and Spica on the ASC seems like a benefic influence. Venus is VOC in its sign and peregrine though and Moon is also VOC (although in Cancer). I rarely see the Moon conjunct the SN having a good chart, especially applying. Anyone? It's an eclipse of the Moon and it lessens its otherwise fruitful influences in Cancer.

but you know heavens are rotten these days and is difficult to find a good moment for anything.

My sentiments too.

Thank you ! Sounds right everything you say. The Mars issues I did notice, but you know why I overlooked it, in our line of people there are many who like Martial arts, weapons, etc., we often debate about coming troubles, so I thought that a 7th ruled by Mars and Mars and Saturn present in XI somehow described part of what we are about. Very likely people in the scheme would share about fighting skills and stuff. Also our kind of people, who fight the system, often have Mars-Saturn issues.

The SN however I missed!!!! Well seen. Absolutely that was a mistake. Moon with South node disgraceful

It was a wonderful idea, about staying in others peoples homes around the world... as in coach.org or Esperanto, but taylored to our needs. I dreamed so much about it ... I was pressed to communicate it cause I thought some young people could benefit from it this summer, before the financial argamedon and all that

anyway...

Hiriolus,

Even with the best calculated Electional Chart, with aspects even to the subject's Natal, things can go awry!

Why?

If you remember that it must be in the Natal and Progressed Horoscope or it will not manifest according to Vivian E. Robson. And I'll go farther on this as Directions are more accurate than the Progressions yet many astrologers haven't conquered these in the recent past as due to the Library at Alexandria being Burned and the fact the Early Church were the Universitys where one learned Geometry; mathematic skills suffered under many astrologers for centurys.

First look at the Asc., lord at 29 degrees Cancer separating from the M.C.; not a great time to beging a social event by this alone.

Then look at the ruler of the 9th and 11th, Mercury in Squ to Mars(Lord of the 7th).

I do like the Sun being being cjt the 9th, have used it many times in travel, but the 9th cusp applying to the Sun would give greater influence.

Again that 29th degree 4th house cusp isn't that inspirational despite the Venus Sextile Saturn, and Saturn trining the cusp of the 4th.

I really think your handicap here is most likely shown within your Progressed Chart as one can not create things positively if the Progressions are stating otherwise as a rule.

Clinton Garrett Soule

First look at the Asc., lord at 29 degrees Cancer separating from the M.C.; not a great time to beging a social event by this alone.

I had also been wondering about the last degree but in relation to Venus. We recently talked elsewhere about a possible weakness of a planet in the last degree of a sign. The electional Asc represents the person. In this case Venus as the ruler of the Libra Asc is in the last degree of Cancer and might be weakened or distracted by the upcoming entry into Leo. The fact that Venus also rules the natal Asc might make this last degree Venus even more applicable. Since traditionally the signs were used to point to planets as significators, I'm thinking this last degree Venus puts you in a weak spot both natally and by election. Also, could Venus right on the MC in the electional chart have brought any current weakness to the forefront? That is, did it make any weakness an active part of the matter rather than hidden from view? I don't know. At this point I can only say that the last degree idea looks like something to keep in mind.

The Moon-SN situation does look like a major negative factor.

hi, Hariolus

I will repeat me a little here if somebody is keeping track :-)

1 - horary is not electional on reverse: an horary provides an answer to a question rooted by the querents will and need. An electional is happening at any time and may or may not be rooted on a previous chart (natal or horary). But as Clinton said, it is always best to have a root chart.

2- horary describes the situation. Electional charts depend on the reality of the situation. Two enterprises can open at the exact same time, but they will have different outcomes because they grown in different soils! One is an apple store other is a little business of electronics, guess who has the most profit...

3 - in your case, what is the probability of the results? What would be expected without astrology? Electional is not vodu, you can?t expect to find a time when people who don?t agree with your opinion by heart will magically think you are right. If this was possible every astrologer would be married to a super model.

4- "I suppose the mistake was focusing too much on the nature of the matter" I don?t think so.IMHO you focused too much on the rules of "beginning" charts, but there are two sets of rules in traditional electional.

5 - I don?t like to criticise electional charts. As Christopher Warnock say, every idiot can do this, as every electional chart has, by definition, fails. You can?t have it all. But maybe a few comments can be useful.

ASC is conjunct spica and natal asc. Good but as pointed out, venus is in 30th degree. Besides that she is in an silent sign.

Moon is also in silent sign and making no close aspects. I would like to see moon in an air sign (even losing dignity) and making an close aspect to a planet that could represent the meeting (Jupiter I suppose?)

Mercury is oriental and free from sunbeans but squaring mars!

Best regards

2- horary describes the situation. Electional charts depend on the reality of the situation. Two enterprises can open at the exact same time, but they will have different outcomes because they grown in different soils! One is an apple store other is a little business of electronics, guess who has the most profit...

Like Robson will tell you in his book, 'two people in the old days could set out on an ocean voyage(Cancer Rising) with the same Electional Time in the iniation and due to different natals and Pregessions, two different circumstances will happen to them differently'.

I've been working with Electional since '88', most were very successful. But all of them exhibited the circumstances of the Electional's chart in that the Asc., Sun Position, M.C., and the end of the matter(4thHouse) were always seen very loud in the endeavor.

Clinton Garrett Soule

Thank you Clinton, Kirk and Yuzuru!
I had missed your very interesting replies, thought it was closed and have no alert messages!

It is particularly interesting what Yuzuru says about a "silent Moon".
That is what I got: silence. Not a "duh", a "yes, but", a "crazy idea, no way". Then would have hurt less