Skyscript Astrology Forum

Good morning,

On the Fixed Stars, attributed to Hermes Trismegistus, has recently been translated from the Latin translation into English for the first time by Dr. med. Rumen Kolev, an erudite, multi-lingual astrological author. The book is not available ex. gr. at Amazon but from the translator's web site. This review is divided into four parts.

1. External qualities

The book, 64 pages, is nicely hard-bound, has good quality paper, a type face readable by nearly all, is copiously illustrated and includes the Latin original. It meets expected academic standards including an 18-page introduction, many footnotes, tables, twelve example astrological charts and a bibliography.

2. Footnotes

The translator, fluent in most if not all of the languages involved in the passage of the text from ancient Greek (and old Persian) to Arabic and to Latin, has valiantly attempted in the layout of the text by numbered paragraphs and in the footnotes to guide the reader through many of the general and specific problems the text contains, ex. gr. mistranslations into Latin including substitution of Saturn for Mars and ambiguities about which fixed stars were meant. The text is obviously even more interpolated, for example with 'God willing' (Insha Allah) or 'God knows best' (Allahu Ahalem) at the end of nearly every section.

3. Content

The book describes the astrological attributes of some 31 fixed stars of up to 4 apparent magnitude, 28 of which 2.6 or below. Planetary qualities are attributed. Due to very inaccurate astronomical positions, in some cases it is not plausible to assert with certainly which fixed star was intended. Interpretations concerning social status and social roles and behaviour are included. In the footnotes and in the tables, the translator compared and contrasted this book to similar works, for example Anonymous from
379.

In the Introduction the translator summarised some of the salient features of the 'system' of the book:

1. Partile conjunctions with Asc, MC, Desc, Sun or Moon

However, the translator proposes larger orbs for fixed stars as follows:

Apparent magnitude, Orb of conjunction in degrees od ecliptic longitude

-1.5 to 0.3 --- 7
0.4 to 0.8 --- 5
0.9 to 1.4 --- 4
1.5 to 1.8 --- 3
1.9 to 2.2 --- 2
2.3 to 3.6 --- 1

2. Six ways of projection of a fixed star onto the ecliptic, using three coordinate systems, one of six added by translator (detailed list struck off at specific request of translator, reason for edit).

(Reviewer's comment: 31 X 6 X 5 = 930 possible positives, more than 2.5 for each zodiacal degree. Thus, it is quite unlikely not to find many positives, even more likely when applying the orbs suggested by the translator.)

4. Translator's understanding and application of the book

The translator, like others, is entitled to his astrological opinions, especially in view of his high qualifications and decades of experience. Nevertheless, it would have been helpful if he had always separated his interpretations, opinions and suggestions from other comments and footnotes strictly pertaining to and directly derived from the original text.

The translator apparently attaches great value to what may be termed 'spiritual thrills' that may be gained through the study of this book. (The reviewer has no objections whatever to such and other thrills but asks to what extent, if at all, they validate astrological assumptions.) One reads on page 3 in the second paragraph after the table of contents:

"And indeed, since I read his [Hermes'] doctrine, hardly a day passes without me marvelling at it all. The words of Hermes exploding in light and illuminating the World wherever I look! The words of Hermes - like a magical wand - touch you, enlighten you, transform you and you wake up from darkness amazed to see the World lit in light immense - marvellous, beautiful and true - forever!"

Given that the few positively selected example charts (neither a random sample nor a sufficiently large one) provide only anecdotal evidence for the translator's views, his polemic critique of Ptolemy, Guido Bonatti and modern astrology on page 6 might appear presumptuous.

The translator apparently favours a quasi-religious approach to astrology. We read on page 7, "In Mesopotamia the fixed stars were revealed divinities." Further, "... the first source of the celestial revelation came down in circa 5 500 BC with the pre-diluvian king of Sippar, En Meduranki, i. e. 'the first Hermes'...".

So we have yet another ancient astrological text on fixed stars available in an English translation, thanks to the diligent and erudite efforts of Dr. Rumen Kolev. Which of such books, if any, is reliable has yet to be demonstrated to any degree of significant relative assurance.

Best regards,

lihin

But other than that, Lihin, did you enjoy the read!?!?

(Reviewer's comment: 31 X 6 X 5 = 930 possible positives, more than 2.5 for each zodiacal degree. Thus, it is quite unlikely not to find many positives, even more likely when applying the orbs suggested by the translator.)

This isn't true, and I'm sure you'd rather be accurate than not. You can't have the DSC degree arising in Paranatollenta with the ASC one, nor the MC degree or any other combination of these you can conjure for instance, and neither can a star Heliacal rise or set with the Moon or ASC or MC or whatever else in that list as, I'm sure you're quite aware, Heliacal rising and setting are a phenomena based upon a celestial body either appearing or disappearing in the morning or evening sky respectively. Added to this, these Heliacal methods are valid for chunks of time rather than degrees of the Sidereal zodiac as you claim, so you're criticism is drowning in whatever agenda you attempted to float it in.

So as to add some balance, I would recommend that everyone at least experiment with these star-lists as they truly give a nice depth to the nativities they influence which are not as numerous as our reviewer would have you believe.

Good afternoon,

My calculation was intended to give a simple overview of the possible combinations. There are five points, six possible positions of each of 31 fixed stars pertaining to each of the five points. Each of the positions is, finally, translated into ecliptic longitude. A position in each coordinate system can be translated into the others.

There may be some occasional repetition of certain specific position when tranlated into ecliptic longitude. On the other hand, assuming an average orb of 3 degrees (on each side of the position), one would arrive at a higher magnitude of possible combinations per ecliptic degree.

The point here is not to calculate in a specific case how many positions might coincide, but only to demonstrate that positives are MUCH more likely than not. I deliberately disregarded the fact that bright fixed stars are unevenly distributed round the zodiac.

I heartily concur with Mr Konrad's suggestion to try out the star lists, if possible in a methodical, statistically relevant way. It would indeed be a thrill to discover that with a margin of error of say +- 1 %, randomly sampled results correlate positively more than say 80 % with the indications in the book.

Best regards,

lihin

lihin wrote:Good afternoon,

My calculation was intended to give a simple overview of the possible combinations. There are five points, six possible positions of each of 31 fixed stars pertaining to each of the five points. Each of the positions is, finally, translated into ecliptic longitude. A position in each coordinate system can be translated into the others.

There may be some occasional repetition of certain specific position when tranlated into ecliptic longitude. On the other hand, assuming an average orb of 3 degrees (on each side of the position), one would arrive at a higher magnitude of possible combinations per ecliptic degree.

Sorry, Lihin, this simply isn't true. 31 stars x 5 positions is the case for the Ecliptical projections only. The Heliacal rising and setting is something related to the whole chart, and not a specific degree. The actual (as in in the sky at the time of birth) rising, setting and culmination is true only for the ASC, DSC and MC respectively. This invalidates your initial claim of 2.5 connections per degree greatly.

The distance of the star from the point is also pertinent in reading the effects of the star, just as it is when considering aspects between planets. I would also note what else is happening around that star and with the planets attributed to its temperament, so already it is not as straight-forward as was initially presented.

The point here is not to calculate in a specific case how many positions might coincide, but only to demonstrate that positives are MUCH more likely than not.

To demonstrate a truth with proven falsehoods?

As with everything, the chart has to be read as a whole and not in some computer-like manner of if x is true then y must also be true, so your talks of % and error-margins are as useful as they are in any other discipline of divination.

Good morning,

Of course the calculation was based on projections onto the ecliptic, what else? If one translates horizon, equatorial or other coordinates into ecliptic ones, one of the two values is always ecliptical longitude. The circle of ecliptic longitude was considered 'centre stage' in both Hellenistic and Mediaeval astrologies.

However, Mr Konrad, please feel free to propose and post a more complete and accurate calculation, if you like using each of the three coordinate systems separately. Do the results suggest that negatives (no or quite few 'hits') become more probable than positives?

Best regards,

lihin

No, I don't think that I will, Lihin, I have made it quite clear in the two posts above. Projection of Ecliptical longitude could not exist at all and still 5 of the 6 ways of connecting stars to a native given by Kolev will exist.

Statistics and % are your forte, and seemingly a prerequisite for your astrology, for me it is like sowing wheat in a field of concrete.

Good afternoon,

Even if we assume (although i do not agree; automated formulae can be downloaded from the internet) that positions expressed in either horizon coordinates (altitude and azimuth) or equatorial coordinates (right ascension and declination) canNOT be translated into ecliptic coordinates (longitude and latitude), we shall still have 31 stars X 2 positions (instead of six) X 5 points = 310 possible positives in each coordinate system.

Even with orbs of 1 degree on each side of the positions, many positives are still quite likely, much more likely than few positives or none. One will have many 'hits' to pick and choose (and to derive 'spiritual' thrills ) from . With the orbs the translator suggested, positives are more likely by roughly a factor of 3.

Once again, the calculations are intended only to give an approximate idea of the magnitudes of positives to be expected. Why should statistics and astrology be incompatible whilst astrology and spherical trigonometry are not?

Best regards,

lihin